That was absolutely ********

In a bad way- a basic frame type (that's essentially what HAVs are) should NEVER be vet-exclusive.
And especially not that tough.

Forgot to mention this, but a high price essentially breaks the game.
Everything, no matter how expensive, is meant to be killable
If something is killable, it can be killed at any battle
The old HAVs could never be replaced on the profits of a single battle
If you lost one every battle, you would go bankrupt
Trying to balance things so that you only run into something that can kill you every x battles is too much of a gamble on the player-base

It's far more simple just to make them killable and replaceable. The best HAV fit should be expected to get destroyed once every battle, and should be cheap enough for 1 per battle to be replaced.

If cutting costs means cutting teirs, I'm all for it. Standard vehicles shouldn't be able to fit prototype turrets anyway.

Forgot to mention this, but a high price essentially breaks the game.
Everything, no matter how expensive, is meant to be killable
If something is killable, it can be killed at any battle
The old HAVs could never be replaced on the profits of a single battle
If you lost one every battle, you would go bankrupt
Trying to balance things so that you only run into something that can kill you every x battles is too much of a gamble on the player-base

No.


De-nerf AV range, double or triple the ISK cost of tanks/tank accessories, make AV also AP (anti personnel, IE make swarms more than just a pathetic situational weapon or at least make them USEFUL and CAPABLE OF DESTROYING THE THINGS THEY'RE ALLEGEDLY MADE TO DESTROY, same with AV grenades why wouldn't they blow up on personnel? Even with a damage nerf just have them make more SENSE), no less than TRIPLE the WP reward for a tank destruction, at least double general vehicle destructions, don't make dropships immortal flying boxes, GIVE US THE DAMN INSTALLATION TURRETS CCP, block instantaneous stealth recall of vehicles because that's such bullshit that you can get a tank within an inch of its life just to have it magic itself away. Nerfing aiming mobility and speed might not be a bad idea for tanks either, the things are like jackrabbits right now, but I not too much.

Piloting a tank SHOULD take SKILL, SCALE IN TERMS OF MONETARY COST and be a CHALLENGE to kill, but also killing it should be FAIRLY REWARDED and ENCOURAGED with FAIR EQUIPMENT.

I believe what they're talking about is lack of swarm dumbfire, and how AV grenades only explode on contact with vehicles.

Everyone who was around for dumbfire swarms is probably still afraid of suicide-swarms

ugh, don't remind me. Those were some dark days. Remember the 'invalid fitting' error?

Make them squad based vehicle - Driver, Shooter

Ok heres one lore based reason
Those are capsuleers piloting those ships and even then the capsule just cuts down on the people required to operate the ship rather than eliminating a crew altogether aside from the smaller ships

Remember boys and girls, when you want to use lore to defend an ass backward position get the lore right and dont forget that dust mercs =/= capsuleers

I doubt HAVs have pods. It doesn't even make sense why we just vanish into them without so much as an opening.

Do we disappear into turret installations? No
Can we hide inside CRUs? No

LAVs have an obvious seat (too lazy to make an entrance animation) and last time I checked, dropships had a door going into the cockpits. they're just closed.

HAVs have nothing

3rd person vehicle views are standard. Dust just happens to have magical floating cameras and cameras on guns

Over the entirety of my time playing Dust, HAVs were ALWAYS broken.

However, it wasn't always the same problem.
HAVs have been broken in several different ways, which we need to remember and avoid.

The first HAV issue I encountered on Dust was that HAVs were very expensive and difficult to skill into, but very difficult to destroy
The issue with this was that tanking was for the elite vets only; AVers couldn't take them down, noobs couldn't skill into or afford a decent HAV, and only another vet could afford the means to take one down (another HAV)

Later, they were easier to skill into, reasonably easy for AV to destroy them, but expensive.
The problem with this is that nobody really used HAVs except pubstompers. The reason behind this being that any AV coordination (or proto AV) could set you back hundreds of thousands of ISK just by destroying one fit.
On top of that, AVers didn't get much as far as WPs (Vehicles were rare), so it was a lose-lose situation.

Currently, the problem is that HAVs are relatively cheap, but very difficult for anything but another HAV to destroy (well, if they have hardeners)
It's incredibly easy for a tanker to make a profit (they've always been WP cows), and now they don't really have to worry about losing much.


The goal we should all be aiming towards as far as balance is an HAV that is both easy to destroy AND won't burn a hole in your pocket if you lose one.

If HAVs are cheap and easy to destroy:

• Noobs can get into them
• It's viable to be a full-time tanker because of cost
• It's viable to be a full-time AVer because there are plenty of targets
• The average infantry aren't completely screwed over, because AVers will do population control
• AVers will make for easy targets, encouraging snipers to aim for them. If snipers kill AVers, they're actually contributing to their team