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Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
2517
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Posted - 2014.02.19 16:40:00 -
[1] - Quote
You CPM members should have figured this out for yourself, but the post I saw from Cat Merc seemed to indicate that the answer was not readily apparent. So let me explain:
People who do PC can afford to run Proto suits all the time.
Everyone else loses money running advanced suits. So if they have BPOGÇÖs they run BPOGÇÖs to save ISK so they can occasionally run Advanced or Proto gear. (If they were good enough to go ISK positive in Advanced or Proto suits they would be in a PC Corp.)
The discrepancy in ISK made from PC versus ISK saved through BPOGÇÖs is a matter of there being vastly more players who are forced to grind ISK in public matches using BPOGÇÖs than there are who get their ISK through PC. Also the segment of the community who are forced to grind ISK using BPOGÇÖs are also the segment of the community that do the most dying, which further inflates the numbers.
Essentially it all comes down to this:
- Good players play PC, can afford to run Proto suits, and donGÇÖt die a lot because they are good.
- Not so good players canGÇÖt get into PC, ware BPOGÇÖs to save ISK, and die constantly (thus saving a lot of ISK through the use of a BPO.)
Or put another way, the more you die in a BPO the more ISK you save through the use of the BPO. If you put a Proto weapon on a BPO suit and die a lot in a match you can loose hundreds of thousands in ISK, while technically saving ISK through the use of a BPO suit.
This should not be taken as an argument to return BPOGÇÖs to the market. It is simply an explanation of the stats I saw reported.
Fox Gaden: DUST Wall of Fame, 2014
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Kevall Longstride
DUST University
Ivy League
1007
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Posted - 2014.02.19 19:09:00 -
[2] - Quote
I touched on this in my last blog.
The BPO are a disaster as far as the economy is concerned and the financial rewards are too high in PC without giving those not in PC an alternative revenue stream, something that I pointed out would happen at last Fanfest.
I'll be pushing hard for some answers in the round tables about what CCP are going to do about the disparity. And the answer is not to bring BPO back by the way.
Mercenary Clone of Dennie Fleetfoot
CEO of DUST University
CPM1 candidate
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Canari Elphus
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
1203
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Posted - 2014.02.19 19:40:00 -
[3] - Quote
You dont need BPOs to make a ton of ISK in matches. I created a new toon and ran nothing but militia gear over the course of 100k WP. I was able to accumulate 25mil ISK a week and hold a 1.75 KDR without squading with anyone else and running only ambushes. BPOs might help some but its mimimal as far as overall profits.
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
2521
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Posted - 2014.02.19 19:57:00 -
[4] - Quote
My preferred answer would be for Corporations to be able to tax the revenue that their Corp members generate doing PVE in their districts.
- This way less skilled players can benefit PC Corporations by generating taxes.
- These less skilled players get a profitable revenue stream from killing drones.
- PC District income is not passive.
Of course this would require PVE, which we will not have for a while.
Although BPOGÇÖs result in more ISK being saved than is gained though PC, I think PC is destabilising the markets far worse than the BPOGÇÖs are. The income that is generated through PC currently means that ISK is not a factor in the Risk versus Reward calculation for the PC players who are sponsored by their Corps. For those with access to the PC cashflow the only Risk versus Reward involves KDR, in which case using expensive suits decreases the risk.
Since PC players have no need to run BPO suits, removing BPOGÇÖs without doing any other adjustments would simply widen the disparity between the Haves and the Have Nots.
On Crash Gaden I ran the Dren Sentinel suit for 6 months and only made 17 million ISK. Two weeks ago I started running the Advanced Sentinel Suit and I now have less than 14 million ISK. In another 2.3 months I will have burned through all the ISK I saved through running a BPO for six months.
So what it boils down to is that Good players can run Proto all the time, and everyone else will struggle to break even running Standard suits.
This will be alleviated somewhat when the Player to Player market is available as the PC players will mostly dump their salvage on buy orders because it is not worth their time to play the market when they can get more ISK through PC. While some of those who do not have access to PC will play the markets to fund their suits. This is not perfect because not everyone has the skill or patience to make a lot of ISK on the market.
Once PVE is introduced, it will provide another revenue stream, where players that donGÇÖt have access to PC can grind out ISK to finance their PVP.
Fox Gaden: DUST Wall of Fame, 2014
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Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
2521
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Posted - 2014.02.19 20:07:00 -
[5] - Quote
Canari Elphus wrote:You dont need BPOs to make a ton of ISK in matches. I created a new toon and ran nothing but militia gear over the course of 100k WP. I was able to accumulate 25mil ISK a week and hold a 1.75 KDR without squading with anyone else and running only ambushes. BPOs might help some but its mimimal as far as overall profits.
I agree with this. Running a BPO suit just means you can afford to run a Standard suit rather than a Militia suit, which gives you another slot, which means you will equip another module, which can make the BPO fit cost as much or more than the Militia fit.
Fox Gaden: DUST Wall of Fame, 2014
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Canari Elphus
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
1205
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Posted - 2014.02.19 21:50:00 -
[6] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:Canari Elphus wrote:You dont need BPOs to make a ton of ISK in matches. I created a new toon and ran nothing but militia gear over the course of 100k WP. I was able to accumulate 25mil ISK a week and hold a 1.75 KDR without squading with anyone else and running only ambushes. BPOs might help some but its mimimal as far as overall profits. I agree with this. Running a BPO suit just means you can afford to run a Standard suit rather than a Militia suit, which gives you another slot, which means you will equip another module, which can make the BPO fit cost as much or more than the Militia fit. Although being able to maintain a 1.75 KDR certainly helps too. I am struggling to get my KDR over 1 in an Advanced Sentinel suit with all Proto modules.
Are you a dedicated heavy or just using it for the added HP? Feel free to hit me up on the CPM1 Candidates chat or drop by the Ancient Exiles. chat. Id be more than happy to run with you and give you any tips/tricks etc
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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Mossellia Delt
Militaires Sans Jeux
965
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Posted - 2014.02.20 12:05:00 -
[7] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:
Everyone else loses money running advanced suits. So if they have BPOGÇÖs they run BPOGÇÖs to save ISK so they can occasionally run Advanced or Proto gear. (If they were good enough to go ISK positive in Advanced or Proto suits they would be in a PC Corp.)
The last part is wrong
Join the Channel - CPM1 Candidates - Get to know who's running.
Delt for CPM1
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Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
2542
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Posted - 2014.02.20 14:28:00 -
[8] - Quote
Canari Elphus wrote:Are you a dedicated heavy or just using it for the added HP? Feel free to hit me up on the CPM1 Candidates chat or drop by the Ancient Exiles. chat. Id be more than happy to run with you and give you any tips/tricks etc
I decided when I first made Fox Gaden in January 2013 that in order to have at least some focus that I would not skill him into Vehicles or Heavy Suits. I wanted to play Scout, but every time I try to shoot the Shotgun I melee instead. (I think it is a combination of nerve/tendon damage and having big hands.)
In 1.3 I created Crash Gaden to be a vehicle alt. I then donned the Sentinel suit for some extra health while I experimented with using the Turret in the LAV. (Turned out turrets sucked in 1.3.) Since I was running him as a Heavy I decided I might as well skill into the HMG. Once I started using the HMG I fell in love with the Heavy class and have mostly been playing Crash every since.
When I started playing HMG Heavy in 1.3 it was quite underpowered, and got even worse later, before they buffed health and then fixed the HMG. So I would call myself a dedicated Heavy. I normally run Crash with a speed fit involving Complex Kinetic Catalysers. I do better KDR wise than I ever did on Fox, although Fox averaged about 3 times as many WP per match, except when Sniping. These days I only run Fox when I have to test changes to update my guides.
Keep in mind that I am nearly 40, had not played a FPS since Doom in 1993, and bought my first consol to play DUST. I have an easy enough time figuring out what I need to do, but I have a hell of a time trying to convince my fingers to do it.
Fox Gaden: DUST Wall of Fame, 2014
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