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Mossellia Delt
Militaires Sans Jeux
901
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Posted - 2014.02.03 16:44:00 -
[1] - Quote
What if a new piece of equipment was added that when thrown down switches enemy equipment to friendly. No WP's are gain for the switched equipment. Would cause people to be more careful about what their placing, that big group of rep hives suddenly start to rep the dude you're fighting or those clusters of uplinks are now spawning in enemy reinforcements.
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Vespasian Andendare
Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION
561
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Posted - 2014.02.03 17:21:00 -
[2] - Quote
Mossellia Delt wrote:What if a new piece of equipment was added that when thrown down switches enemy equipment to friendly. No WP's are gain for the switched equipment. Would cause people to be more careful about what their placing, that big group of rep hives suddenly start to rep the dude you're fighting or those clusters of uplinks are now spawning in enemy reinforcements. The "fix" to equipment spam are flux grenades. Problem solved. We don't need new tech, and--imagine that--the tools were at your hands the whole time.
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Mossellia Delt
Militaires Sans Jeux
901
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Posted - 2014.02.03 17:35:00 -
[3] - Quote
Vespasian Andendare wrote:Mossellia Delt wrote:What if a new piece of equipment was added that when thrown down switches enemy equipment to friendly. No WP's are gain for the switched equipment. Would cause people to be more careful about what their placing, that big group of rep hives suddenly start to rep the dude you're fighting or those clusters of uplinks are now spawning in enemy reinforcements. The "fix" to equipment spam are flux grenades. Problem solved. We don't need new tech, and--imagine that--the tools were at your hands the whole time.
Flux doesn't stop spam, spam is a mentality, not an act.
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Kigurosaka Laaksonen
DUST University Ivy League
229
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Posted - 2014.02.03 18:08:00 -
[4] - Quote
Limit on deployed equipment should be tied to the player, not the equipment slot.
Deployed equipment would be tied to your suit. If you want to throw 14 drop uplinks, you get to stay in your up link suit or they all blow up when you switch.
Deployed equipment should have some sort of proximity limitation specific to the equipment.
These new mechanics would all be subject to balance changes. Active deployed equipment limits could be adjusted. REs could be closer to other REs. Hives couldn't overlap AoEs. Uplinks would need to be a certain distance, etc. Make this apply to the whole team's deployed equipment or an individual's deployed equipment.
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Squagga
The State Protectorate
123
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Posted - 2014.02.03 18:16:00 -
[5] - Quote
I'm not sure if you guys are upset because the enemy is using too much tech? Cause that's just foolish backwards thinking. If you're reffering to all the equipment in the cities that makes the game lag, that's an easy fix. CCP just needs to make it stop glowing
Reloading, the silent killer.
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CaoticFox
Axis of Chaos
137
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Posted - 2014.02.03 18:22:00 -
[6] - Quote
Vespasian Andendare wrote:Mossellia Delt wrote:What if a new piece of equipment was added that when thrown down switches enemy equipment to friendly. No WP's are gain for the switched equipment. Would cause people to be more careful about what their placing, that big group of rep hives suddenly start to rep the dude you're fighting or those clusters of uplinks are now spawning in enemy reinforcements. The "fix" to equipment spam are flux grenades. Problem solved. We don't need new tech, and--imagine that--the tools were at your hands the whole time. no... u r wrong sir... equipment spam irreparably damages the current battle... even after u flux the whole map... its lagged till its over... after 2-3 such lag-bombed battles (the un fixed memory leak) a full PS3 reset is required to remedy the lasting effects of equipment spam |
CaoticFox
Axis of Chaos
137
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Posted - 2014.02.03 18:23:00 -
[7] - Quote
Squagga wrote:I'm not sure if you guys are upset because the enemy is using too much tech? Cause that's just foolish backwards thinking. If you're reffering to all the equipment in the cities that makes the game lag, that's an easy fix. CCP just needs to make it stop glowing & humming |
Squagga
The State Protectorate
123
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Posted - 2014.02.03 18:28:00 -
[8] - Quote
CaoticFox wrote:Squagga wrote:I'm not sure if you guys are upset because the enemy is using too much tech? Cause that's just foolish backwards thinking. If you're reffering to all the equipment in the cities that makes the game lag, that's an easy fix. CCP just needs to make it stop glowing & humming
I like the humming it makes me feel sleepy
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Cross Atu
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
1897
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Posted - 2014.02.03 20:18:00 -
[9] - Quote
Kigurosaka Laaksonen wrote:Limit on deployed equipment should be tied to the player, not the equipment slot. Agreed, this would make more sense.
Kigurosaka Laaksonen wrote: Deployed equipment would be tied to your suit. If you want to throw 14 drop uplinks, you get to stay in your up link suit or they all blow up when you switch.
Something would have to be done to prevent equipment de-spawns upon player death, but aside from that this is worth considering.
Kigurosaka Laaksonen wrote: Deployed equipment should have some sort of proximity limitation specific to the equipment.
These new mechanics would all be subject to balance changes. Active deployed equipment limits could be adjusted. REs could be closer to other REs. Hives couldn't overlap AoEs. Uplinks would need to be a certain distance, etc. Make this apply to the whole team's deployed equipment or an individual's deployed equipment.
I don't support this one, it limits useful tactical deployments of equipment, substantially decreasing their effective on the field value. Working to moderate spam is one thing, nerfing the value of the equipment line however is the wrong way to go about it.
Other considerations that must be included are the SP/CPU/PG/ISK costs of these pieces of gear. For each reduction in function there needs to be a corresponding reduction in the element(s) of cost so that the risk vs reward dynamic is maintained. Leaving the issue of spam aside the equipment line is frankly in need of development love and expansion not nerfs or reduction. A focus on keeping alterations surgical rather than sweeping so that changes directly effect the problem area rather than 'carpet bomb' it away, is key to the continued health of the game.
0.02 ISK Cross
EDIT: Additionally, all equipment skills should provide a skill buff of some sort (depending on the equipment in question) rather than purely be "unlock" skills. There are many reasons for this and I'll elaborate if needed but I'm trying to minimize the "wall o text" effect.
SupportSP Rollover & an improved Recruting System
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Cross Atu
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
1897
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Posted - 2014.02.03 20:23:00 -
[10] - Quote
CaoticFox wrote:Squagga wrote:I'm not sure if you guys are upset because the enemy is using too much tech? Cause that's just foolish backwards thinking. If you're reffering to all the equipment in the cities that makes the game lag, that's an easy fix. CCP just needs to make it stop glowing & humming ^This
If the only concern that players have regarding equipment is one related to lag/performance that's not a balance fix and should not be addressed as one. CCP needs to resolve the issue in another manner that does not effect game balance.
[Useful note: I have an SSD in my PS3 and have never experienced lag from deployed equipment even when stress testing my system in full matches by having several logi deploy full loads of both nanos and links within a single room and then engaging in a multi-target firefight (from two angles) within that room.]
For those who have a, non-lag, related concern with regards to equipment let's start specifically stating what that concern is, and why it's a problem, just to keep the discussion clear and useful.
Cheers, Cross
SupportSP Rollover & an improved Recruting System
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RKKR
The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine
718
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Posted - 2014.02.03 20:59:00 -
[11] - Quote
Fight equipment spam by throwing down more equipment!
Delt for CPM1!
In all seriousness: what the guy in post #2 said. |
Mossellia Delt
Militaires Sans Jeux
903
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Posted - 2014.02.03 21:20:00 -
[12] - Quote
RKKR wrote:Fight equipment spam by throwing down more equipment!
Delt for CPM1!
In all seriousness: what the guy in post #2 said.
Fluxes don't stop someone from throwing down equipment. The idea that someone could affectively 'steal' your equipment might though.
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RKKR
The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine
719
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Posted - 2014.02.03 21:39:00 -
[13] - Quote
Mossellia Delt wrote:RKKR wrote:Fight equipment spam by throwing down more equipment!
Delt for CPM1!
In all seriousness: what the guy in post #2 said. Fluxes don't stop someone from throwing down equipment. The idea that someone could affectively 'steal' your equipment might though.
I would steal em back. + 1 equipment.
You would steal em back + 1 equipment.
...
You will probably feel the urge to comment that stealing wouldn't involved throwing more equipment, but why should all those nanohives be based on throwing down equipment then? |
Kigurosaka Laaksonen
DUST University Ivy League
232
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Posted - 2014.02.04 00:27:00 -
[14] - Quote
Cross Atu wrote:I don't support this one, it limits useful tactical deployments of equipment, substantially decreasing their effective on the field value. Working to moderate spam is one thing, nerfing the value of the equipment line however is the wrong way to go about it.
Other considerations that must be included are the SP/CPU/PG/ISK costs of these pieces of gear. For each reduction in function there needs to be a corresponding reduction in the element(s) of cost so that the risk vs reward dynamic is maintained. Leaving the issue of spam aside the equipment line is frankly in need of development love and expansion not nerfs or reduction. A focus on keeping alterations surgical rather than sweeping so that changes directly effect the problem area rather than 'carpet bomb' it away, is key to the continued health of the game.
0.02 ISK Cross
EDIT: Additionally, all equipment skills should provide a skill buff of some sort (depending on the equipment in question) rather than purely be "unlock" skills. There are many reasons for this and I'll elaborate if needed but I'm trying to minimize the "wall o text" effect.
It doesn't need to be an overall equipment nerf. If two standard Hives (just for examples) can refill 2 HMG clips completely, changing one standard Hive to refill 2 HMG clips completely is effectively the same thing even though you wouldn't be able to place two hives on top of each other. No tactical deployment value is lost.
If someone throwing down 10 Uplinks can spawn in a total of 100 people before all their Uplinks break, 1 Uplink able to spawn in 100 people is the same thing, minus the equipment spam. (numbers are just for the sake of argument.)
The only thing it does is reduce equipment spam. Adjusting values could result in a scenario with no overall nerf.
"For each reduction in function there needs to be a corresponding reduction in the element(s) of cost so that the risk vs reward dynamic is maintained."
You're missing the point. The risk vs reward dynamic is being changed.
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Kigurosaka Laaksonen
DUST University Ivy League
232
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Posted - 2014.02.04 01:08:00 -
[15] - Quote
CCP and I are on the same page with this one, for the most part.
CCP wrote: 8. Do you feel equipment spam is a problem and if so what are your thoughts on possible solutions for littered uplinks and stacked nanohives? by The Council of Planetary Management (CPM)
Use of equipment is obviously encouraged but abuse of any system to the point where itGÇÖs detrimental to gameplay is obviously a problem. So, yeah, itGÇÖs definitely an issue. WeGÇÖd like to approach the problem by first increasing the PG/CPU costs along with role-specific skills that reduce those costs to discourage mass fitting of drop uplinks and nanohives, and put them back into the hands of the specialists. Eventually, weGÇÖd want to introduce the ability for the enemy to hack a piece of equipment and take ownership of it (to encourage smarter placement of equipment instead of dumping dozens in plain sight) and have War Barge-fired EMP strikes that destroy all equipment over a very large area.
SOURCE
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