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Monkey MAC
Lost Millennium
1614
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Posted - 2014.01.20 09:21:00 -
[31] - Quote
lok rark wrote:I call BS on you LAG fakers. Anybody who runs different weapons KNOWS with some weapons you can fire around corners. Its one of the things I .... dislike about this game. When im being hit by one of those weap's, I usually calculate how much faster I have to find cover to compensate for the bullets that follow you. When Im using them, I hold fire when the person gets to cover... otherwise I feel dirty and cheap. Maybe thats whats putting me off playing atm IDK
So you are telling me, the hitscan, a function that calls a straight line from the end of the gun, is now curving? Please its the one who believe AA is responsible who are BSing.
Aim Assisst change the direction your barrell is facing, it tracks targets for about a foot, but it doesn't change trajectories. You not curving bullets around walls, instead there are 2 possible lag based reasons.
1) Your hit box is warped, under movement it is possible your hit box acts like a Comets tail. 2) You were already shot, lag spikes can cause ht detection to be delayed.
Tanks 514
I told you, I bloody well told you.
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1
|
shaman oga
Nexus Balusa Horizon
1358
|
Posted - 2014.01.20 09:38:00 -
[32] - Quote
I've changed server and now i'm happy
1.8 it's so secret that nobody know what will be in it, even after patch notes...
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lok rark
StealthSquad
29
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Posted - 2014.01.20 09:54:00 -
[33] - Quote
How many bullets would you need to hit you behind a wall, before you think they are actually curving? Also If I keep firing while they are in cover they get killed. Lag cant work both ways.
I use to run with a monkey when I started this game...not so fun bro...
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Monkey MAC
Lost Millennium
1616
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Posted - 2014.01.20 11:18:00 -
[34] - Quote
lok rark wrote:How many bullets would you need to hit you behind a wall, before you think they are actually curving? Also If I keep firing while they are in cover they get killed. Lag cant work both ways.
I use to run with a monkey when I started this game...not so fun bro...
Tell you what, you wanna prove that AA is curving rounds, show me a picture of a laser rifle with curved trajectory. Or show me a video of a guy who has been hiding behind cover for at least 2 seconds getting shot around that cover.
Until that point don't tell the computer programmer that lag doesn't work both ways, newsflash - it does
Tanks 514
I told you, I bloody well told you.
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1
|
m twiggz
Pradox One Proficiency V.
243
|
Posted - 2014.01.20 11:39:00 -
[35] - Quote
Sinboto Simmons wrote:You ever get those moments when you're well within cover but end up being killed by a rifle user with AA on?
Yeah........that sucks devs. It's called lag. Nothing Devs can do about it. It's been happening in FPS games since Doom. Yeah Doom, circa 1993. 21 years later and it still exists. CCP would be the last company I would trust to come up with a solution for it. |
lok rark
StealthSquad
29
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Posted - 2014.01.20 22:06:00 -
[36] - Quote
Monkey MAC wrote:lok rark wrote:How many bullets would you need to hit you behind a wall, before you think they are actually curving? Also If I keep firing while they are in cover they get killed. Lag cant work both ways.
I use to run with a monkey when I started this game...not so fun bro...
Tell you what, you wanna prove that AA is curving rounds, show me a picture of a laser rifle with curved trajectory. Or show me a video of a guy who has been hiding behind cover for at least 2 seconds getting shot around that cover. Until that point don't tell the computer programmer that lag doesn't work both ways, newsflash - it does
I dont need to prove $hit I take 6- 8 magic bullets while in cover ( I run Heavy) How many would need to hit you before you actually thought the bullets curve? 20-30-1000. How many before your actually opened your mind? None because you have already formed an opinion. Which proves you wouldn't even accept that mystic video.
The fact is there are two types of people playing this game. People who play and enjoy the game and people who only play to **** on other people. The latter...are the same people who get on the forums to grief legit players who have real issues...
Happens all the time. OP calls B.S on a legit problem, gets flamed by griefer's , months later gets totally vindicated by someone else's video.
Sorry if your butt hurt cause I dont want to play with you...but dont take it personally... I just want to Quote: play and enjoy the game |
Monkey MAC
Lost Millennium
1617
|
Posted - 2014.01.20 23:31:00 -
[37] - Quote
lok rark wrote:Monkey MAC wrote:lok rark wrote:How many bullets would you need to hit you behind a wall, before you think they are actually curving? Also If I keep firing while they are in cover they get killed. Lag cant work both ways.
I use to run with a monkey when I started this game...not so fun bro...
Tell you what, you wanna prove that AA is curving rounds, show me a picture of a laser rifle with curved trajectory. Or show me a video of a guy who has been hiding behind cover for at least 2 seconds getting shot around that cover. Until that point don't tell the computer programmer that lag doesn't work both ways, newsflash - it does I dont need to prove $hit I take 6- 8 magic bullets while in cover ( I run Heavy) How many would need to hit you before you actually thought the bullets curve? 20-30-1000. How many before your actually opened your mind? None because you have already formed an opinion. Which proves you wouldn't even accept that mystic video. The fact is there are two types of people playing this game. People who play and enjoy the game and people who only play to **** on other people. The latter...are the same people who get on the forums to grief legit players who have real issues... Happens all the time. OP calls B.S on a legit problem, gets flamed by griefer's , months later gets totally vindicated by someone else's video. Sorry if your butt hurt cause I dont want to play with you...but dont take it personally... I just want to Quote: play and enjoy the game
So Im the one trying to explain to him what the actual problem is and Im a griefer? Please lets not beat around the bush here, can you prove AimAssisst is curving bullets? Can you actually prove it, with imperical evidence?
Until you can answer yes to that question, then 1) If you can't prove it exsists how can you say it does? 2) Why can you dismiss the factual explanations that have been provided by both me and numerous other "legit" players, based upon a theory which you can't prove exsists?
I'll say it once, I'll say it a thousand times, ITS NOT F*CKING AIM ASSIST!! Do you want me to spell it out any clearer for you?
No? Well tough **** hombre, prepare for the whole god damn theoretical explanation.
A hitscan is function called by weapons in FPS games to determine wether a shot is deemed a hit or a miss. These hitscans are called everytime a round is fired, the hitscan travels from the barrel of the gun at a randomly determined angle (to simulate dispersion), in A STRAIGHT LINE. Technically in the programming no trajectory is calculated, the bullet instantaneously travels to the first obstacle it finds.
A hitbox is an invisible box that exsists around every entity in an FPS that can take damage. This box contains programmig on how to react when a hitscan is detected passing through it. It is here the damage is applied.
Lag is the bane of any internet game, its when the server and client programmes are out of sync. This leads to a large amount of problems, instructions can be missed (rubberbanding) , guns won't fire etc. In addition to this you can imagine that hitbox states are going to be all over the place.
All it takes is 1 single packet, a 32 byte packet, out of thousands being a sent a second to get corrupt a d you can observe all of the following effects. 1) Translation - The hitbox moves seperate of the user or vice versa, it then follows the user from its new location. This was prelevant in earlier games where people would stand with backs to the wall and be invincible, because the hitbox was behind the wall.
2) Warping - The hitbox stretches as it attempts to satisfy both server and client states simultaneously, this creates a phenomenon where a hit box can be stretched indefinitely behind the player. Imagine a sonics blue blur, thats what a warped hitbox looks like.
3) Loss - If the movement command is lost, the hit box won't move, mea while the character profile may or may not move giving turn to the above 2 symptoms.
TL:DR Aim Assist physically curving rounds, is PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE, if you actually have any experience with computers you would understand this. So stop trying to get ri ofa perfectly fine mechanic that helps rookie and lower skill players, just because you and a few other people cacan't behind cover before you're almost dead.
Tanks 514
I told you, I bloody well told you.
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1
|
Lorhak Gannarsein
1254
|
Posted - 2014.01.20 23:38:00 -
[38] - Quote
lok rark wrote:I call BS on you LAG fakers. Anybody who runs different weapons KNOWS with some weapons you can fire around corners. Its one of the things I .... dislike about this game. When im being hit by one of those weap's, I usually calculate how much faster I have to find cover to compensate for the bullets that follow you. When Im using them, I hold fire when the person gets to cover... otherwise I feel dirty and cheap. Maybe thats whats putting me off playing atm IDK
I watching a squaddie run into cover the other day.
He got blitzed just before he made it, but do you know what he said?
"lol, got killed around a corner. F this game."
Happily printing ISK with permahardeners and MLT blasters.
Just let me get a couple mil more before nerf, CCP!
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Lorhak Gannarsein
1256
|
Posted - 2014.01.20 23:53:00 -
[39] - Quote
m twiggz wrote:Sinboto Simmons wrote:You ever get those moments when you're well within cover but end up being killed by a rifle user with AA on?
Yeah........that sucks devs. It's called lag. Nothing Devs can do about it. It's been happening in FPS games since Doom. Yeah Doom, circa 1993. 21 years later and it still exists. CCP would be the last company I would trust to come up with a solution for it.
Considering that fixing lag for an internationally played game would take hardware far more advanced than what we currently possess, yeah, I would think that a company hat makes software about internet spaceships and clones would be one of the last people to come up with it.
Why the CCP bashing?
Happily printing ISK with permahardeners and MLT blasters.
Just let me get a couple mil more before nerf, CCP!
|
hgghyujh
Expert Intervention Caldari State
227
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 00:17:00 -
[40] - Quote
this used to be a lag issue only now bullet magnetism is making it a staple of the game. |
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Bethhy
Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance
889
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 00:18:00 -
[41] - Quote
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:Sinboto Simmons wrote:You ever get those moments when you're well within cover but end up being killed by a rifle user with AA on?
Yeah........that sucks devs. Aa doesn't shoot into small spaces for you, instead it increases the amount of time that the reticule stays on you. If you were hit from around a corner right after you run into it, it's because of latency. If you were hit around a corner because you were sticking out and you didn't know it, that's a symptom of bad FOV mechanics. It's been what... months now and we still have people believing the Aim Assist preemptively targets for you? It's about as active as one of those cheap rubbery window-stickies you can get at arcades. it has to be stuck to an object before it grips for a little bit, then slides off again. I've never turned it on (except about 6 months ago wondering what the hell it was, then it was turned back off the same day), and I've never really had a problem in combat because of others using Aim Assist...
That's because seeing is believing.. IWS and CPM's have talked about bullet magnetism... Welcome to one of the "Aim Assist" Features...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFqlnXZU6bw <----- Bullet Magnetism ...
This has been on near 20 different video's since 1.4 showing examples of bullets hitting when your not on target.
This "Lagg" NEVER HAPPENED like this in DUST. Through over a year of playing DUST. Magical Lagg can explain away a lot but not something that just shows up hand and hand with 1.4... and the Aim Assist addition. |
Bethhy
Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance
889
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 00:22:00 -
[42] - Quote
Monkey MAC wrote:lok rark wrote:I call BS on you LAG fakers. Anybody who runs different weapons KNOWS with some weapons you can fire around corners. Its one of the things I .... dislike about this game. When im being hit by one of those weap's, I usually calculate how much faster I have to find cover to compensate for the bullets that follow you. When Im using them, I hold fire when the person gets to cover... otherwise I feel dirty and cheap. Maybe thats whats putting me off playing atm IDK So you are telling me, the hitscan, a function that calls a straight line from the end of the gun, is now curving? Please its the one who believe AA is responsible who are BSing. Aim Assisst change the direction your barrell is facing, it tracks targets for about a foot, but it doesn't change trajectories. You not curving bullets around walls, instead there are 2 possible lag based reasons. 1) Your hit box is warped, under movement it is possible your hit box acts like a Comets tail. 2) You were already shot, lag spikes can cause ht detection to be delayed.
Ask how many KB/M users are killing targets well behind cover? because i run out of fingers doing it with a DS3 in a night. |
Monkey MAC
Lost Millennium
1617
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 00:24:00 -
[43] - Quote
Bethhy wrote:Monkey MAC wrote:lok rark wrote:I call BS on you LAG fakers. Anybody who runs different weapons KNOWS with some weapons you can fire around corners. Its one of the things I .... dislike about this game. When im being hit by one of those weap's, I usually calculate how much faster I have to find cover to compensate for the bullets that follow you. When Im using them, I hold fire when the person gets to cover... otherwise I feel dirty and cheap. Maybe thats whats putting me off playing atm IDK So you are telling me, the hitscan, a function that calls a straight line from the end of the gun, is now curving? Please its the one who believe AA is responsible who are BSing. Aim Assisst change the direction your barrell is facing, it tracks targets for about a foot, but it doesn't change trajectories. You not curving bullets around walls, instead there are 2 possible lag based reasons. 1) Your hit box is warped, under movement it is possible your hit box acts like a Comets tail. 2) You were already shot, lag spikes can cause ht detection to be delayed. Ask how many KB/M users are killing targets well behind cover? because i run out of fingers doing it with a DS3 in a night.
I count 1 kill behind walls - period, I was getting 10FPS got a kill on a guy while reloading.
Tanks 514
I told you, I bloody well told you.
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1
|
Monkey MAC
Lost Millennium
1617
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 00:28:00 -
[44] - Quote
Bethhy wrote:Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:Sinboto Simmons wrote:You ever get those moments when you're well within cover but end up being killed by a rifle user with AA on?
Yeah........that sucks devs. Aa doesn't shoot into small spaces for you, instead it increases the amount of time that the reticule stays on you. If you were hit from around a corner right after you run into it, it's because of latency. If you were hit around a corner because you were sticking out and you didn't know it, that's a symptom of bad FOV mechanics. It's been what... months now and we still have people believing the Aim Assist preemptively targets for you? It's about as active as one of those cheap rubbery window-stickies you can get at arcades. it has to be stuck to an object before it grips for a little bit, then slides off again. I've never turned it on (except about 6 months ago wondering what the hell it was, then it was turned back off the same day), and I've never really had a problem in combat because of others using Aim Assist... That's because seeing is believing.. IWS and CPM's have talked about bullet magnetism... Welcome to one of the "Aim Assist" Features... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFqlnXZU6bw <----- Bullet Magnetism ... This has been on near 20 different video's since 1.4 showing examples of bullets hitting when your not on target. This "Lagg" NEVER HAPPENED like this in DUST. Through over a year of playing DUST. Magical Lagg can explain away a lot but not something that just shows up hand and hand with 1.4... and the Aim Assist addition.
This video again? He is still inside the crosshair for starters! Secondly bullet magnetism and bullet curving are 2 entirely different things. Lag doesn't magic away anything, its the problem, improve your line quality, play on your localised server and try and tell me it still happens as often as you claim.
Tanks 514
I told you, I bloody well told you.
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1
|
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
4352
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 10:34:00 -
[45] - Quote
lok rark wrote:How many bullets would you need to hit you behind a wall, before you think they are actually curving? Also If I keep firing while they are in cover they get killed. Lag cant work both ways.
I use to run with a monkey when I started this game...not so fun bro... Two things you're failing to account for.
1. The fact that people have already mentioned hitbox warping as a known problem with DUST - very often a player's apparent location isn't exactly where their hitbox is, or the hitbox "expands" through the space they've been moving like a comet's tail.
2. SERVER SIDE HIT DETECTION. Just because you and the other guy see him behind cover, doesn't mean the SERVER has acknowledged it properly yet.
If you ignore the first point, you'd have a solid argument, because most FPS games use client-side hit detection. With client-side hit detection, regardless of whether your target thinks they're in cover or not, if YOU can see them, and YOU see your shot connect, they get hit. With server-side hit detection like DUST uses, your firing angle is sent to the server, and it traces a line where you shot and damages the first target to get in the way of that line. It's possible for you OR the target to see the shots hitting through a wall, and if there's direct player-to-player information as well as the server-side tracking, it's possible for BOTH to see the victim in cover when the server doesn't recognise that having happened yet. |
steadyhand amarr
Bragian Order Amarr Empire
2173
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 10:50:00 -
[46] - Quote
Classic lag u were allready dead just took your box a little to long to notice it
"i dont care about you or your goals, just show me the dam isk"
winner of EU squad cup
GOGO power rangers
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Scar Scrilla
Cobra Kommando
38
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 11:44:00 -
[47] - Quote
Monkey MAC wrote:lok rark wrote:Monkey MAC wrote:lok rark wrote:How many bullets would you need to hit you behind a wall, before you think they are actually curving? Also If I keep firing while they are in cover they get killed. Lag cant work both ways.
I use to run with a monkey when I started this game...not so fun bro...
Tell you what, you wanna prove that AA is curving rounds, show me a picture of a laser rifle with curved trajectory. Or show me a video of a guy who has been hiding behind cover for at least 2 seconds getting shot around that cover. Until that point don't tell the computer programmer that lag doesn't work both ways, newsflash - it does I dont need to prove $hit I take 6- 8 magic bullets while in cover ( I run Heavy) How many would need to hit you before you actually thought the bullets curve? 20-30-1000. How many before your actually opened your mind? None because you have already formed an opinion. Which proves you wouldn't even accept that mystic video. The fact is there are two types of people playing this game. People who play and enjoy the game and people who only play to **** on other people. The latter...are the same people who get on the forums to grief legit players who have real issues... Happens all the time. OP calls B.S on a legit problem, gets flamed by griefer's , months later gets totally vindicated by someone else's video. Sorry if your butt hurt cause I dont want to play with you...but dont take it personally... I just want to Quote: play and enjoy the game So Im the one trying to explain to him what the actual problem is and Im a griefer? Please lets not beat around the bush here, can you prove AimAssisst is curving bullets? Can you actually prove it, with imperical evidence? Until you can answer yes to that question, then 1) If you can't prove it exsists how can you say it does? 2) Why can you dismiss the factual explanations that have been provided by both me and numerous other "legit" players, based upon a theory which you can't prove exsists? I'll say it once, I'll say it a thousand times, ITS NOT F*CKING AIM ASSIST!! Do you want me to spell it out any clearer for you? No? Well tough **** hombre, prepare for the whole god damn theoretical explanation. A hitscan is function called by weapons in FPS games to determine wether a shot is deemed a hit or a miss. These hitscans are called everytime a round is fired, the hitscan travels from the barrel of the gun at a randomly determined angle (to simulate dispersion), in A STRAIGHT LINE. Technically in the programming no trajectory is calculated, the bullet instantaneously travels to the first obstacle it finds. A hitbox is an invisible box that exsists around every entity in an FPS that can take damage. This box contains programmig on how to react when a hitscan is detected passing through it. It is here the damage is applied. Lag is the bane of any internet game, its when the server and client programmes are out of sync. This leads to a large amount of problems, instructions can be missed (rubberbanding) , guns won't fire etc. In addition to this you can imagine that hitbox states are going to be all over the place. All it takes is 1 single packet, a 32 byte packet, out of thousands being a sent a second to get corrupt a d you can observe all of the following effects. 1) Translation - The hitbox moves seperate of the user or vice versa, it then follows the user from its new location. This was prelevant in earlier games where people would stand with backs to the wall and be invincible, because the hitbox was behind the wall. 2) Warping - The hitbox stretches as it attempts to satisfy both server and client states simultaneously, this creates a phenomenon where a hit box can be stretched indefinitely behind the player. Imagine a sonics blue blur, thats what a warped hitbox looks like. 3) Loss - If the movement command is lost, the hit box won't move, mea while the character profile may or may not move giving turn to the above 2 symptoms. TL:DR Aim Assist physically curving rounds, is PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE, if you actually have any experience with computers you would understand this. So stop trying to get ri ofa perfectly fine mechanic that helps rookie and lower skill players, just because you and a few other people cacan't behind cover before you're almost dead.
Don't waste your time on explaining the effect of lag on hitboxes of moving targets. After your explanation, even an ******** ape would have understand the subject of the matter.
Lag is causing hit boxes to slightly lag behind your "actual" position. For those who still don't understand: Just pick a Rail Rifle and shoot at running enemies....aim assist on or off doesn't really matter in this case, nor do magic curving bullets. It's just....simply......
---L A G---
"Si tacuisses, philosophus mansisses"
Scar Scrilla - Proud Commando User & Cobra Kommander
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Monkey MAC
Lost Millennium
1623
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 11:56:00 -
[48] - Quote
Scar Scrilla wrote:Monkey MAC wrote:lok rark wrote:Monkey MAC wrote:
Tell you what, you wanna prove that AA is curving rounds, show me a picture of a laser rifle with curved trajectory. Or show me a video of a guy who has been hiding behind cover for at least 2 seconds getting shot around that cover.
Until that point don't tell the computer programmer that lag doesn't work both ways, newsflash - it does
I dont need to prove $hit I take 6- 8 magic bullets while in cover ( I run Heavy) How many would need to hit you before you actually thought the bullets curve? 20-30-1000. How many before your actually opened your mind? None because you have already formed an opinion. Which proves you wouldn't even accept that mystic video. The fact is there are two types of people playing this game. People who play and enjoy the game and people who only play to **** on other people. The latter...are the same people who get on the forums to grief legit players who have real issues... Happens all the time. OP calls B.S on a legit problem, gets flamed by griefer's , months later gets totally vindicated by someone else's video. Sorry if your butt hurt cause I dont want to play with you...but dont take it personally... I just want to Quote: play and enjoy the game So Im the one trying to explain to him what the actual problem is and Im a griefer? Please lets not beat around the bush here, can you prove AimAssisst is curving bullets? Can you actually prove it, with imperical evidence? Until you can answer yes to that question, then 1) If you can't prove it exsists how can you say it does? 2) Why can you dismiss the factual explanations that have been provided by both me and numerous other "legit" players, based upon a theory which you can't prove exsists? I'll say it once, I'll say it a thousand times, ITS NOT F*CKING AIM ASSIST!! Do you want me to spell it out any clearer for you? No? Well tough **** hombre, prepare for the whole god damn theoretical explanation. A hitscan is function called by weapons in FPS games to determine wether a shot is deemed a hit or a miss. These hitscans are called everytime a round is fired, the hitscan travels from the barrel of the gun at a randomly determined angle (to simulate dispersion), in A STRAIGHT LINE. Technically in the programming no trajectory is calculated, the bullet instantaneously travels to the first obstacle it finds. A hitbox is an invisible box that exsists around every entity in an FPS that can take damage. This box contains programmig on how to react when a hitscan is detected passing through it. It is here the damage is applied. Lag is the bane of any internet game, its when the server and client programmes are out of sync. This leads to a large amount of problems, instructions can be missed (rubberbanding) , guns won't fire etc. In addition to this you can imagine that hitbox states are going to be all over the place. All it takes is 1 single packet, a 32 byte packet, out of thousands being a sent a second to get corrupt a d you can observe all of the following effects. 1) Translation - The hitbox moves seperate of the user or vice versa, it then follows the user from its new location. This was prelevant in earlier games where people would stand with backs to the wall and be invincible, because the hitbox was behind the wall. 2) Warping - The hitbox stretches as it attempts to satisfy both server and client states simultaneously, this creates a phenomenon where a hit box can be stretched indefinitely behind the player. Imagine a sonics blue blur, thats what a warped hitbox looks like. 3) Loss - If the movement command is lost, the hit box won't move, mea while the character profile may or may not move giving turn to the above 2 symptoms. TL:DR Aim Assist physically curving rounds, is PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE, if you actually have any experience with computers you would understand this. So stop trying to get ri ofa perfectly fine mechanic that helps rookie and lower skill players, just because you and a few other people cacan't behind cover before you're almost dead. Don't waste your time on explaining the effect of lag on hitboxes of moving targets. After your explanation, even an ******** ape would have understand the subject of the matter. Lag is causing hit boxes to slightly lag behind your "actual" position. For those who still don't understand: Just pick a Rail Rifle and shoot at running enemies....aim assist on or off doesn't really matter in this case, nor do magic curving bullets. It's just....simply...... ---L A G---
Eh, I went a bit of the rails there, it doesn't seem to have mattered but oh well! And thank you, it probably went a bit to far in depth but knowledge is power and all that!
Tanks 514
I told you, I bloody well told you.
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1
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