Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Dalmont Legrand
237
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 15:48:00 -
[1] - Quote
Amarr ships use Antimatter reactors. Gallente ships use Fusion reactors. Caldari ships use Graviton reactors. Minmatar ships use Nuclear reactors.
EVE ships have limitations in their power supply, EVE players know that the baddest situation is staying in the middle of battle having no energy resource to perform anything.
Vehicles intend energy resource why not implement power indicator like in EVE ships? By such all vehicles will have reduced time in order to perform at higher rates, more skills of a player will be needed in order to perform well, as energy will drain resouce and the time while it recharges will be the time where it is mostly vulnerable. Additional skills and new modules can be made.
Energy additional modules could be the new thing. Weapons' use could drain resources too, why not vehicle lose speed power when using guns or active loss in power supply and or performance such as speed when using modules?
Why active modules can't drain power too when active? Repair modules will drain energy in order to repair. This will reduce power resource of vehicle and will lower quantity of times that module can be used. Can be solution to reducing modules usage and/or not its efficiency.
New types and variety of vehicles is a big theme to talk about, many modules as camouflage, types of vision and ammo types(I want to see how uranium ammo shreds null-cannon into parts), heavy dropships, assault dropships, vehicles is a big theme in here, not considering drones and all futuristic stuff that can be made, but still all this runs into wall of DEV team time, abilities and technical possibilities not considering vision.
HAV
No matter how futuristic and powerful metal alloy is, tank link is a tank link, light-weighted hardened united small plates in order to make it elastic for movement, these are not wheels.
So using any module to speed up which gains speed right from place, (I don't know how they do not drift yet) is insane and force projected onto links in plates will make them burst, heat or even shred into parts which will difficult movement or even make you stop. Gradual speed up that is what intended in here as a solution.
Speeds are imaginable, but it shouldn't be like a carrier catapult for jets, because tanks are not jets and such "catapults" is an excess.
LAV
Basically same as for HAV except for wheels, but these can be more speedy and instead of having two players and a turret can be four players seats and they are able to shoot, back seats can be turned backwards so two players will protect from behind and sides.
Riding shotgun will be back as a thing.
Aircrafts
Rockets, bombs and stuff which is related to aviation weaponry I will skip because you know why.
Aviation related, well assault and heavy are a thing, but yet we have only transporting.
There is as much about it we can speak as about LAVs and HAVs.
P.S.: Deploying drones not only from EVE into district but from DUST vehicles is a thing. But hey! What can I do...
Of something nothing is everything.
|
Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star. EoN.
2229
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 15:54:00 -
[2] - Quote
TLDR - Capacitors
I want them in anyways, copy n paste from EVE and add in the mods too
Intelligence is OP
|
Knox Firmus
SCIENCE FOR LIFE
4
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 15:57:00 -
[3] - Quote
I always assumed the reason there was no capacitor mechanic in DUST was because there was already a limiting factor built into vehicles. Modules have a recharge time, guns overheat. In EVE, everything can perma-run if you've fit your ship to do so. it's a balancing act of mechanics. In this much faster-paced game, with a much more limited control scheme, cooldowns and overheating might be the best option, IMHO. |
jordy mack
Ultramarine Corp
102
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 15:59:00 -
[4] - Quote
I thought tanks ran on tears...
Less QQ more PewPew
|
Dalmont Legrand
237
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 15:59:00 -
[5] - Quote
Knox Firmus wrote:I always assumed the reason there was no capacitor mechanic in DUST was because there was already a limiting factor built into vehicles. Modules have a recharge time, guns overheat. In EVE, everything can perma-run if you've fit your ship to do so. it's a balancing act of mechanics. In this much faster-paced game, with a much more limited control scheme, cooldowns and overheating might be the best option, IMHO.
How about having both as a balance factor?
Of something nothing is everything.
|
Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
1550
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 16:01:00 -
[6] - Quote
Cooldowns are....simple and easy. Which might be a good thing.
Capacitor however would allow for a lot of mechanics making more vehicles and AV more interesting. However this would require another overhaul of vehicles and I just don't see it happening anytime soon.
1.8 Analysis - Sentinel Damage Efficiency Calcs
|
Dalmont Legrand
237
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 16:04:00 -
[7] - Quote
jordy mack wrote:I thought tanks ran on tears...
You meant track?
Of something nothing is everything.
|
Michael-J-Fox Richards
Molon Labe. Public Disorder.
20
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 16:07:00 -
[8] - Quote
no i dont want all that. thanks though
http://i40.tinypic.com/33w8wtd.jpg
Not my highest, but the best one i've taken a picture of.
Assault Dropship Pilot
|
Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION
1980
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 16:14:00 -
[9] - Quote
Capacitor management as a function of game play could be a really interesting way to balance vehicles. I"m not sure if players would find it tedious or not, but if 'charging the capacitor' of vehicles required the kind of nuance and differences that rifles on dropsuits do.
Example.
Nuclear Reactors vs. Graviton Reactors
Drawbacks:
Nuclear reactors: Overheat causes a long period of armor damage over time. Graviton reactors: Overheat causes significant agility loss of vehicle.
Management mechanics:
Rather than just passively recharge capacitors would have to be manually managed to maintain their maximum recharge rate. If unmanaged the recharge rate drops to 25% of maximum. So players would swap between a 'capacitor priming UI' mode, kind of like switching to equipment/sidearm on a dropsuit, and back to their turret. Perhaps secondary turret gunners could also man capacitors UIs.
Nuclear reactors (UI ideas):
Nuclear reactors would be based on getting the reactor core in an ideal heat zone to maintain energy stability. Therefore using R1 and 'square' to 'prime' and 'cool' the core to the right temperature will increase the stability of the core. Capacitor amount and core stability are directly related. Overuse of the capacitor would lead to quick cooling which would quickly reduce it's energy output. Accidentally over-priming the capacitor would overheat causing long term radioactive damage to the vehicle and user. Emergency cooling would take-over cutting core temperature (and energy production) down to minimal levels.
Damage modules are the most efficient users of nuclear reactor energy and hybrid weapons and laser weapons are the least.
Graviton reactors (UI ideas):
Graviton reactors are about space/mass distortion. Graviton cores are more stable and naturally balanced. Graviton cores can be 'primed' by rapidly pushing R1 in order to increase core stability. The higher the current stability, the faster you must press R1 to further increase stability. It's easy to maintain long-term decent power generation, but difficult to maintain the maximum. Overpriming/overheating causes spatial distortions that drastically affect the agility of the vehicle, while a cool core will take a significant amount of time to recharge from nothing.
Hybrid weapons and shield modules are the most efficient users of graviton reactors while armor modules are the least. |
Dalmont Legrand
237
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 16:19:00 -
[10] - Quote
Beren Hurin wrote:Capacitor management as a function of game play could be a really interesting way to balance vehicles. I"m not sure if players would find it tedious or not, but if 'charging the capacitor' of vehicles required the kind of nuance and differences that rifles on dropsuits do.
Example.
Nuclear Reactors vs. Graviton Reactors
Drawbacks:
Nuclear reactors: Overheat causes a long period of armor damage over time. Graviton reactors: Overheat causes significant agility loss of vehicle.
Management mechanics:
Rather than just passively recharge capacitors would have to be manually managed to maintain their maximum recharge rate. If unmanaged the recharge rate drops to 25% of maximum. So players would swap between a 'capacitor priming UI' mode, kind of like switching to equipment/sidearm on a dropsuit, and back to their turret. Perhaps secondary turret gunners could also man capacitors UIs.
Nuclear reactors (UI ideas):
Nuclear reactors would be based on getting the reactor core in an ideal heat zone to maintain energy stability. Therefore using R1 and 'square' to 'prime' and 'cool' the core to the right temperature will increase the stability of the core. Capacitor amount and core stability are directly related. Overuse of the capacitor would lead to quick cooling which would quickly reduce it's energy output. Accidentally over-priming the capacitor would overheat causing long term radioactive damage to the vehicle and user. Emergency cooling would take-over cutting core temperature (and energy production) down to minimal levels.
Damage modules are the most efficient users of nuclear reactor energy and hybrid weapons and laser weapons are the least.
Graviton reactors (UI ideas):
Graviton reactors are about space/mass distortion. Graviton cores are more stable and naturally balanced. Graviton cores can be 'primed' by rapidly pushing R1 in order to increase core stability. The higher the current stability, the faster you must press R1 to further increase stability. It's easy to maintain long-term decent power generation, but difficult to maintain the maximum. Overpriming/overheating causes spatial distortions that drastically affect the agility of the vehicle, while a cool core will take a significant amount of time to recharge from nothing.
Hybrid weapons and shield modules are the most efficient users of graviton reactors while armor modules are the least.
Added to main topic
Of something nothing is everything.
|
|
Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION
1980
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 16:39:00 -
[11] - Quote
One last part about my idea is that the micro management would be fairly small:
25%-50% average efficiency would be where your core would be at if you didn't touch your capacitor the whole match. 50%-85% efficiency would be where your core was if you only messed with it for 10 seconds at the beggining of the match and one or two other times. 85%-95% efficiency would require 5-10 seconds of micro management every couple of minutes. 95%-100% efficiency would require tuning the core less than every minute.
Reactor management could be something done by a gunner.
Also, the point of switching to capacitors would/could take the place of time limits on active modules.
So you could have a hardener active for as long as your capacitor could manage. If you run our of capacitor then you must then wait for a cooldown to restart your hardener. So running too many active modules with low efficiencies and shooting a capacitor based turret could mean a quick crippling of your offensive and defensive capabilities. |
Soraya Xel
The Corporate Raiders Top Men.
1113
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 17:08:00 -
[12] - Quote
There is an ironic notion about how everywhere DUST decides to do a game mechanic differently than EVE, the long-term success is often achieved when DUST finally just does it the way EVE does it.
Capacitor could definitely help in certain situations, particularly if we ever hit the topic of vehicle cloaking devices. Which will eventually come up. (I think a stealthy dropship would be particularly cool.)
I think the biggest problem with vehicles though isn't the mechanics themselves, but the roles. Dropships have a critical strategic role in games. HAVs don't. HAVs are currently oversized nearly indestructible assault suits that go 30/0 in matches. Which is both a disservice to everyone else, for being OP, and a disservice to HAV drivers, for giving them nothing game-critical to do. (Besides pubstomping.)
Vehicles need defined roles. And in some cases, I think the game modes we have may need to be changed to create those roles. And then the vehicles need to be balanced to optimize them for doing those roles. HAVs should have a game-mode-critical purpose that places them as valued members of a strategic plan, a huge target for opposing forces, and a centerpiece of friendly support and movement.
I'd like to be your CPM1 candidate
|
Ku Shala
Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu
761
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 17:28:00 -
[13] - Quote
They invented alternators in 1891
Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu Apply today!
For the State
Caldari Loyalist
|
Dirks Macker
Enlightened Infantries Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
113
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 17:35:00 -
[14] - Quote
Ships are staffed with competent people who can drive reactors safely. Armies lack such personnel.
Enlightened Indoctrination Blog
|
Ryder Azorria
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
823
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 18:06:00 -
[15] - Quote
Too complicated for an FPS.
Driving a tank is meant to be about blowing stuff up, not spending the entire match micromanaging a half dozen different modules. |
Beren Hurin
Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION
1982
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 18:43:00 -
[16] - Quote
Ryder Azorria wrote:Too complicated for an FPS.
Driving a tank is meant to be about blowing stuff up, not spending the entire match micromanaging a half dozen different modules.
Did you read the part about how this mechanic would be done just a few times per game for just a few seconds? |
Hawkings Greenback
Red Star. EoN.
88
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 18:50:00 -
[17] - Quote
Ryder Azorria wrote:Too complicated for an FPS.
Driving a tank is meant to be about blowing stuff up, not spending the entire match micromanaging a half dozen different modules.
I have started using tanks on an alt, having to "manage" a tank would for me add another dimension to vehicle play. I would relish the idea of a capacitor and the challenge it could provide. Besides you have to micromanage modules to a certain extent at the moment AND it opens up the possibility of other ways beside brute force to take out HAV's.
Logi For Life-Mini Logi suit wearer & proud
Forum Lurker-level unknown
Do clones dream of Dolly the sheep
|
Flix Keptick
Red Star. EoN.
3316
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 19:06:00 -
[18] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:There is an ironic notion about how everywhere DUST decides to do a game mechanic differently than EVE, the long-term success is often achieved when DUST finally just does it the way EVE does it.
Capacitor could definitely help in certain situations, particularly if we ever hit the topic of vehicle cloaking devices. Which will eventually come up. (I think a stealthy dropship would be particularly cool.)
I think the biggest problem with vehicles though isn't the mechanics themselves, but the roles. Dropships have a critical strategic role in games. HAVs don't. HAVs are currently oversized nearly indestructible assault suits that go 30/0 in matches. Which is both a disservice to everyone else, for being OP, and a disservice to HAV drivers, for giving them nothing game-critical to do. (Besides pubstomping.)
Vehicles need defined roles. And in some cases, I think the game modes we have may need to be changed to create those roles. And then the vehicles need to be balanced to optimize them for doing those roles. HAVs should have a game-mode-critical purpose that places them as valued members of a strategic plan, a huge target for opposing forces, and a centerpiece of friendly support and movement. The role of a HAV would be heavy anti vehicle. The problem is that CCP hasn't released **** for vehicles yet (again, lack of content creating imbalance)
Lack of content makes stuff broken...
Tank driver // specialized tank destroyer
|
darkiller240
WarRavens Auxiliaries League of Infamy
280
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 19:09:00 -
[19] - Quote
Yes please we want capacitors, then shield and amour taking will be more like eve please CCP
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
|
Kharga Lum
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
238
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 19:13:00 -
[20] - Quote
Ryder Azorria wrote:Too complicated for an FPS.
Driving a tank is meant to be about blowing stuff up, not spending the entire match micromanaging a half dozen different modules.
This is New Eden, if you want simple this isn't it.
The topic of Vehicle Capacitor has been brought up since early beta and ignored. CCP has never commented on the idea. It would make vehicles far more interesting and the system, in the long run, would make subtle balancing changes easier to do. |
|
Skihids
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
2696
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 19:20:00 -
[21] - Quote
Vehicle capacitors are obviously more easily integrated with eWar and offer better system control for the pilot.
Either CCP doesn't feel they are competent to implement vehicle capacitors or they feel the player base is incapable of understanding it.
Given that infantry stamina is the exact same thing CCP already has the code so the former is doubtful. That must mean they are aiming the game at players who can't comprehend the idea. If so, I fear for future changes. |
knight of 6
SVER True Blood Public Disorder.
1127
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 19:26:00 -
[22] - Quote
and here I thought you couldn't make the idea of capacitors any worse an idea. well I'm flabbergasted so good job I guess.
knight of 6 wrote:no.
vehicle combat is too fast for a capacitor to be a viable balancing tool, cool thingy/what have you. honestly I question how much time everyone who suggests this has spent in a vehicle(you aren't the first and undoubtedly wont be the last).
being completely honest the module wheel is a sub optimal solution to having a larger number of mods than buttons. anyone who has spent any time in a vehicle has turned off mods accidentally or selected the wrong mod and this typically results in death or best case a severe disadvantage. it also obstructs the screen and inhibits combat.
pulsing a rep is a common practice with a capacitor, for those unaware repairs/shield boosters take up a massive amount of cap per cycle so capsuleers switch them on and off regularly depending on how the fight is going and what other modules need to be on. can you imagine trying to pulse a rep while flying a dropship? or while in the middle of a tank battle? cap management in combat would be a nightmare.
in eve with a couple of mouse clicks you lock onto and fire on a ship automatically you don't need to aim or fire and there is no cover. flying is largely taken out of the pilots hands as well, this frees up time and concentration to focus on cap management. not to mention the TTK in eve is very long so if you make a mistake it's not the end of the world. the module activation system is very simple and fast to use unlike dust's and doesn't interrupt damage output or flight.
TL;DR no.
there is why caps don't work, yes it's and Xpost from feedback/requests but I like it and don't have much to add to it.(also I was right he wasn't the last)
now to "rechargeing" the capacitor... why? WHY WOULD YOU DO THIS? no. NO. NO.
quick time events are bad mkay? in all forms. manual cap recharge is literally the least fun thing I can think of at the moment.
"God favors the side with the best artillery" ~ Napoleon
Ko6, scout.
CLOSED BETA VET
|
Dalmont Legrand
240
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 19:41:00 -
[23] - Quote
knight of 6 wrote:and here I thought you couldn't make the idea of capacitors any worse an idea. well I'm flabbergasted so good job I guess. knight of 6 wrote:no.
vehicle combat is too fast for a capacitor to be a viable balancing tool, cool thingy/what have you. honestly I question how much time everyone who suggests this has spent in a vehicle(you aren't the first and undoubtedly wont be the last).
being completely honest the module wheel is a sub optimal solution to having a larger number of mods than buttons. anyone who has spent any time in a vehicle has turned off mods accidentally or selected the wrong mod and this typically results in death or best case a severe disadvantage. it also obstructs the screen and inhibits combat.
pulsing a rep is a common practice with a capacitor, for those unaware repairs/shield boosters take up a massive amount of cap per cycle so capsuleers switch them on and off regularly depending on how the fight is going and what other modules need to be on. can you imagine trying to pulse a rep while flying a dropship? or while in the middle of a tank battle? cap management in combat would be a nightmare.
in eve with a couple of mouse clicks you lock onto and fire on a ship automatically you don't need to aim or fire and there is no cover. flying is largely taken out of the pilots hands as well, this frees up time and concentration to focus on cap management. not to mention the TTK in eve is very long so if you make a mistake it's not the end of the world. the module activation system is very simple and fast to use unlike dust's and doesn't interrupt damage output or flight.
TL;DR no. there is why caps don't work, yes it's and Xpost from feedback/requests but I like it and don't have much to add to it.(also I was right he wasn't the last) now to "rechargeing" the capacitor... why? WHY WOULD YOU DO THIS? no. NO. NO.quick time events are bad mkay? in all forms. manual cap recharge is literally the least fun thing I can think of at the moment.
It seems like neither of you both have heard about macros. All this arguments are stated in order to ease your push-to-kill experience, which is not what I am looking into, I have enough experience in vehicles and I must say that I am ready for new experience.
Narrow-minded players searching for easy ways? Hardcore is what I need and hardcore is what it must become. If you can't handle it then leave. It is progress - advance in complexity.
No mental harm is intended in this commentary.
Of something nothing is everything.
|
knight of 6
SVER True Blood Public Disorder.
1128
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 20:06:00 -
[24] - Quote
Dalmont Legrand wrote:It seems like neither of you both have heard about macros. All this arguments are stated in order to ease your push-to-kill experience, which is not what I am looking into, I have enough experience in vehicles and I must say that I am ready for new experience. Narrow-minded players searching for easy ways? Hardcore is what I need and hardcore is what it must become. If you can't handle it then leave. It is progress - advance in complexity. No mental harm is intended in this commentary. I'm not against difficulty I am against adding mechanics that subtract more from the overall experience of the game than they could ever possibly add.
also I'll be sure to tell him that he has no idea what macro is
"God favors the side with the best artillery" ~ Napoleon
Ko6, scout.
CLOSED BETA VET
|
Skihids
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
2697
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 22:17:00 -
[25] - Quote
Short duration events don't necessarily have to be cycled manually.
Shield boost?
Make it smart. Have it pulse until Shields are at maximum and then shut down. That's what you want and the system knows shield status so it's a no brainer.
Ideally we should be able to use both the DS3 for direction control and a mappable KB for module control. The selection wheel is a lousy interface for critical systems control. Imagine something like that on your car.
One panic slap on the boost button and you are back up to max shields.
Enemy turning to fire on you? Slap the hardener button and return fire. Coast clear? Shut down the hardener before it drains all your cap with another press. |
Stupid Blueberry
Nova Corps Marines Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
71
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 22:33:00 -
[26] - Quote
Just posting here to say I have thought of this idea before and I approve. Plus, it would make me more comfortable piloting a vehicle with a capacitor coming from an EVE standpoint. |
True Adamance
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
5798
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 22:40:00 -
[27] - Quote
Stupid Blueberry wrote:Just posting here to say I have thought of this idea before and I approve. Plus, it would make me more comfortable piloting a vehicle with a capacitor coming from an EVE standpoint.
I hate your Rail Sica it was invisible to me the other day when I tried to OB you....missed and the armour HAV tanked the whole thing...... I was a sad tanker trying to OB another tanker...
"My Faith in you is absolute; my sword is Yours, My God, and Your will guides me now and for all eternity."
|
Stupid Blueberry
Nova Corps Marines Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
71
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 22:42:00 -
[28] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Stupid Blueberry wrote:Just posting here to say I have thought of this idea before and I approve. Plus, it would make me more comfortable piloting a vehicle with a capacitor coming from an EVE standpoint. I hate your Rail Sica it was invisible to me the other day when I tried to OB you....missed and the armour HAV tanked the whole thing...... I was a sad tanker trying to OB another tanker...
lol This character is by no means a tanker, that Sica was probably just a counter-measure to another tank on your team. My tank alt is named Cyinii Dvah and he runs blaster madrugars.
|
True Adamance
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
5798
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 22:45:00 -
[29] - Quote
Stupid Blueberry wrote:True Adamance wrote:Stupid Blueberry wrote:Just posting here to say I have thought of this idea before and I approve. Plus, it would make me more comfortable piloting a vehicle with a capacitor coming from an EVE standpoint. I hate your Rail Sica it was invisible to me the other day when I tried to OB you....missed and the armour HAV tanked the whole thing...... I was a sad tanker trying to OB another tanker... lol This character is by no means a tanker, that Sica was probably just a counter-measure to another tank on your team. My tank alt is named Cyinii Dvah and he runs blaster madrugars.
Yeah....I was sitting there on top of a building promising my squad that I was going to kill Stupid Blueberry....only to have you tank melt back into the mountains and disappear, only to reappear later unscathed.
"My Faith in you is absolute; my sword is Yours, My God, and Your will guides me now and for all eternity."
|
Stupid Blueberry
Nova Corps Marines Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
71
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 22:46:00 -
[30] - Quote
..................Sicah OP |
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |