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shaman oga
Nexus Balusa Horizon
1321
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Posted - 2014.01.14 10:28:00 -
[1] - Quote
Treat infantry like tanks, of course without active modules for the moment.
Buff basic shield recharge and lower the time before recharge starts, also give us powerfull modules.
There is no need to buff shield extenders (except ADV they have to give 44).
In the same time, buff armor reppers, 4 hp basic, 7 hp adv, 10 hp complex (e.g. i don't know the numbers)
In this way we TTK can be the same as it's now, but a shield tanker can play his role and a armor tanker would not be dead after the first encounter.
1.8 it's so secret that nobody know what will be in it, even after patch notes...
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Rogue Saint
Science For Death
674
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Posted - 2014.01.14 10:36:00 -
[2] - Quote
DUST is missing true "tanking" ... Being able to stack mods so that the opponent has to bring enough DPS to break it (like EvE ffs).
The only viable option at the moment is armour with a core rep tool.
GôêGÆ+GÆ+GƦ - Causes headaches, it's official
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jordy mack
Ultramarine Corp
95
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Posted - 2014.01.14 10:49:00 -
[3] - Quote
Sure, I love a shield rep tool
Less QQ more PewPew
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shaman oga
Nexus Balusa Horizon
1322
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Posted - 2014.01.14 10:51:00 -
[4] - Quote
Rogue Saint wrote:DUST is missing true "tanking" ... Being able to stack mods so that the opponent has to bring enough DPS to break it (like EvE ffs).
The only viable option at the moment is armour with a core rep tool.
In EVE you can't hide behind a cover
1.8 it's so secret that nobody know what will be in it, even after patch notes...
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Flyingconejo
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
394
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Posted - 2014.01.14 10:55:00 -
[5] - Quote
Making everything more powerful (modules, weapons, suits,...) over time is not the answer.
The problem is the rifles, all of them. So nerf the rifles instead of buffing everything else. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
Covert Intervention
7879
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Posted - 2014.01.14 10:59:00 -
[6] - Quote
TTK is the problem. Shields excelled before 1.4 and it was not just because of the armour buff then that they started to fall from grace.
Things like aim assist and better hit detection have crushed speed tanking - one of the advantages of shield tanking. It also means that they die before being able to leverage their superior regen.
Level 7 Forum Warrior
Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution
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shaman oga
Nexus Balusa Horizon
1322
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Posted - 2014.01.14 11:06:00 -
[7] - Quote
Flyingconejo wrote:Making everything more powerful (modules, weapons, suits,...) over time is not the answer.
The problem is the rifles, all of them. So nerf the rifles instead of buffing everything else.
Rifles are fine (except scr that is still OP), TTK is fine, if they shoot you from the back, you have to die 90% of the time, i don't care if you are in proto and the other guy was in mlt, he ambushed you and you have to die, imo.
If you think at tanks now, they can recover their HP really fast, but they die if they are exposed at too much DPS.
Suits should work the same, if you don't die in a fire fight, you should be able to recover your HP faster than now.
Shield tankers will recover their HP faster than armor tankers, armor tankers will have a greater pool of HP, but a slower repair rate.
1.8 it's so secret that nobody know what will be in it, even after patch notes...
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xxwhitedevilxx M
Ave atque Vale.
1478
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Posted - 2014.01.14 11:14:00 -
[8] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:TTK is the problem. Shields excelled before 1.4 and it was not just because of the armour buff then that they started to fall from grace.
Things like aim assist and better hit detection have crushed speed tanking - one of the advantages of shield tanking. It also means that they die before being able to leverage their superior regen.
Totally agreed. Maybe just speed up a little bit the shield recharge delay on shield tankers suits (Cal, Min)? if ttk is lower then shield recharge delay should be lower!
Tank 514.
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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens
League of Infamy
1568
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Posted - 2014.01.14 11:22:00 -
[9] - Quote
shaman oga wrote:Treat infantry like tanks, of course without active modules for the moment.
Buff basic shield recharge and lower the time before recharge starts, also give us powerfull modules.
There is no need to buff shield extenders (except ADV they have to give 44).
In the same time, buff armor reppers, 4 hp basic, 7 hp adv, 10 hp complex (e.g. i don't know the numbers)
In this way we TTK can be the same as it's now, but a shield tanker can play his role and a armor tanker would not be dead after the first encounter.
I gave up armor tanking I run Minmatar suits now :/ I Love self reps. People in FPS are so worried about kills that there is nobody to help rep armor. Then they call us OP when we start using hybrid hives. |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens
League of Infamy
1568
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Posted - 2014.01.14 11:26:00 -
[10] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:TTK is the problem. Shields excelled before 1.4 and it was not just because of the armour buff then that they started to fall from grace.
Things like aim assist and better hit detection have crushed speed tanking - one of the advantages of shield tanking. It also means that they die before being able to leverage their superior regen.
I think the biggest problem is damage mods... many shield tanks have double the armor than they do shields. So they can't even take advantage of their shield repairs because their armor tanking...
But if there were no damage mods then the problem is dual tanks who done incredible self shield reps and decent armor reps out classing any armor suit any day. |
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Flyingconejo
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
395
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Posted - 2014.01.14 11:38:00 -
[11] - Quote
shaman oga wrote:
Rifles are fine (except scr that is still OP), TTK is fine, if they shoot you from the back, you have to die 90% of the time, i don't care if you are in proto and the other guy was in mlt, he ambushed you and you have to die, imo.
If you think at tanks now, they can recover their HP really fast, but they die if they are exposed at too much DPS.
Suits should work the same, if you don't die in a fire fight, you should be able to recover your HP faster than now.
Shield tankers will recover their HP faster than armor tankers, armor tankers will have a greater pool of HP, but a slower repair rate.
You don't understand me. I'm not complaining about TTK at all. I think it is too low, but if I have to play it like it is now I don't mind.
I agree with you that shield tanking is worse than armor tanking at the moment. And your numbers could be an answer to balance it with armor tanking against the current rifles, but it would make it too good against any other weapon.
Mass drivers, Laser Rifles, Shotguns, Sniper Rifles, Plasma Cannons, Flaylock pistols,etc... basically any weapon that is not a auto/semiauto rifle is underperforming against the current fits.
If you buff shield tanking, maybe you will adress the issue of armor tanking/shield tanking against current rifles, but you will make every other weapon even more obsolete.CCP should balance the weapons first. Otherwise the current trend of everybody using the same fittings and weapons would be made even worse.
Just my opinion, though.  |
dzizur
Zumari Force Projection
Caldari State
24
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Posted - 2014.01.14 12:52:00 -
[12] - Quote
last i checked shields did not impose a speed penalty as armor does, so IMO it fits the "shield playstyle" , shoot, don't let the opponent drain you below 1 shield hp, use the "partialy depleted delay" bonus it gives you to recharge, and eventually you'll kill the armor tanker (if he's not standing on rep hives etc ;P) also, you could use shield regulators.
just some thoughts on this
@ OP buffing and nerfing everything around is not the answer, try using tools you're given as best as you can instead of finding new ways to "balance everything"
some of you seem to want shield to be the same as armor, it just isn't, if it was, why it was named shield instead of armor 2?
EDIT: I also think that some changes that remnant mentioned (changing weapon prof to specific type of damage) will be a game changer in this situation (apart from CR being able to cut through armor effortlessly even in this state) |
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