DUST Search - rumors of a respec

Rasatsu wrote:

Sirys Lyons wrote:

The point could be made, however, that despite being a "launched" title, there are substantial additions and changes being made to DUST that are far more indicative of a "Beta" status, rather than 'Expansions' or 'Iterative Releases'. They are still figuring out how to make the game work.

The point could be made that the logi-assault FOTM players have already had the benefits of the SP they put into those dropsuits, and when the nerf-hammer finally falls they have had a good run.

Now the suggestion is that they do not pay the usual dues of FOTM chasing, that is to say having SP invested in skills they don't need in the next FOTM they decide to chase.

Now there will always be new *stuff* to skill into that CCP didn't get around to adding the first time around, or changes that some people will see as 'game-breaking' for their special brand of playstyle... Yet why the respec fetish, are you so upset that you can't reshuffle all your SP into this season's FOTM that you are willing to destroy the long-term prospects of DUST?

(And no, I'm not just suggesting the death of DUST as a drama thing, It is actually based on long-term observation of various skill systems)


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Sirys Lyons Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 18	Posted - 2014.01.11 19:47:00 - [1] - Quote I asked a question similar to this a short while ago. I hadn't played in a long time, logged in, and saw millions of available SP - way more than the passive SP would have generated. Turns out, because I had heavily invested in the vehicle skill trees, I got that SP back. But I didn't get it back because CCP reworked the vehicles - I got it back because they reworked the vehicle skill trees. And they did that to model the dropsuit skill trees, which they obviously felt were better. So, as I see it...a total respect? I'd love it. Honestly, I think it would be fun to give everyone a fresh start now that the game is so different than it was a year ago. After all, Dust is about making decisions and choices, but when the choice you make can change after you choose...it's not much of a choice, but more of a gamble. But I really don't think we'll get one just because racial suits are dropping. But I wish we would. A partial SP refund? Only if CCP makes major changes to skill trees somewhere, and those changes directly affect you. It works the same as in EVE - if a skill gets removed, or a skill tree reorganized, you generally get some SP back. Last major memory of this was when the 'Learning' skills were removed.
Sirys Lyons Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 20	Posted - 2014.01.11 20:49:00 - [2] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: T'orq wrote: Destroying DUST? Most RPG games I know of have some sort of respec system, WoW, Mass Effect 3, Borderlands1&2. Those are awesome games, and you think by giving respecs in DUST will ruin the game. I disagree with you. And the only MMO RPG game that has been running for 10 years that has managed to keep a good progression for both newbie and veteran players is... TADA!!!! EVE ONLINE Those games you mention are either ****** (WoW), or not particularly relevant nor long-running. Respec-entitlement will only lead this game to the abyss of power-creep. Second Decade Collectors Editions, I plan on getting the Third. Are you? The point could be made, however, that despite being a "launched" title, there are substantial additions and changes being made to DUST that are far more indicative of a "Beta" status, rather than 'Expansions' or 'Iterative Releases'. They are still figuring out how to make the game work. I'm not advocating for constant (or even frequent) respecs, but merely the possibility to alter one's skill directions when major content changes come around. This happened within the Beta period a number of times, and I frankly don't see it being a big problem here and now, when the game has yet to achieve very solid and stable feel - the ground is still shifting in major ways beneath our feet. If there is no respec in the future, the best decision is not to spend SP. Because we don't know how anything will balance out in 6mo. Imagine if in EvE, battleships might be slow, expensive, devastators of the battlefields or they might be quick, nimble, multi-player-controlled gun platforms or they might be fast, single weapon sniper rifles. Tanks have been all those things in Dust. And I could see someone who skilled into them for one of those playing styles to very dissappointed when their months of work literally disappears because of "balance" shifts...that still don't fix balance, but do destroy fun.
Sirys Lyons Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 20	Posted - 2014.01.11 20:49:00 - [3] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: T'orq wrote: Destroying DUST? Most RPG games I know of have some sort of respec system, WoW, Mass Effect 3, Borderlands1&2. Those are awesome games, and you think by giving respecs in DUST will ruin the game. I disagree with you. And the only MMO RPG game that has been running for 10 years that has managed to keep a good progression for both newbie and veteran players is... TADA!!!! EVE ONLINE Those games you mention are either ****** (WoW), or not particularly relevant nor long-running. Respec-entitlement will only lead this game to the abyss of power-creep. Second Decade Collectors Editions, I plan on getting the Third. Are you? The point could be made, however, that despite being a "launched" title, there are substantial additions and changes being made to DUST that are far more indicative of a "Beta" status, rather than 'Expansions' or 'Iterative Releases'. They are still figuring out how to make the game work on a fundamental typically pre-release level. I'm not advocating for constant (or even frequent) respecs, but merely the possibility to alter one's skill directions when major content changes come around. This happened within the Beta period a number of times, and I frankly don't see it being a big problem here and now, when the game has yet to achieve very solid and stable feel - the ground is still shifting in major ways beneath our feet. If there is no respec in the future, the best decision is not to spend SP. Because we don't know how anything will balance out in 6mo. Imagine if in EvE, battleships might be slow, expensive, devastators of the battlefields or they might be quick, nimble, multi-player-controlled gun platforms or they might be fast, single weapon sniper rifles. Tanks have been all those things in Dust. And I could see someone who skilled into them for one of those playing styles to very dissappointed when their months of work literally disappears because of "balance" shifts...that still don't fix balance, but do destroy fun.
Sirys Lyons Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 22	Posted - 2014.01.11 21:27:00 - [4] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: Sirys Lyons wrote: The point could be made, however, that despite being a "launched" title, there are substantial additions and changes being made to DUST that are far more indicative of a "Beta" status, rather than 'Expansions' or 'Iterative Releases'. They are still figuring out how to make the game work. The point could be made that the logi-assault FOTM players have already had the benefits of the SP they put into those dropsuits, and when the nerf-hammer finally falls they have had a good run. Now the suggestion is that they do not pay the usual dues of FOTM chasing, that is to say having SP invested in skills they don't need in the next FOTM they decide to chase. Now there will always be new stuff to skill into that CCP didn't get around to adding the first time around, or changes that some people will see as 'game-breaking' for their special brand of playstyle... Yet why the respec fetish, are you so upset that you can't reshuffle all your SP into this season's FOTM that you are willing to destroy the long-term prospects of DUST? (And no, I'm not just suggesting the death of DUST as a drama thing, It is actually based on long-term observation of various skill systems) The suggestion is that, until the game is in a stable place where there are no more huge play-style changing nerfs/buffs/additions happening in a mad rush to balance the game, we all chill out. It's no secret that the "balance" of Dust is swinging like a pendulum - on update these things are way OP, the next those are. And now we are adding in lots of new weapons and suits. My thought is to let players have their SP back occasionally. Why? 1. Some people are stuck in SP situations that no longer fit their play-style because of gear nerfs/buffs that don't necessarily reflect great or lesser killing ability, but just don't make the role as fun anymore. 2. The new content (suits, weapons, mods) would get a thorough vetting if people could skill into them immediately. 3. It allows people who may be tired of the game and are already heavily invested a way to explore a new path without reverting to the pain of MLT-fitting-continuous-death in that speciality, or simply logging on for the bonus but not actually playing for 6 months their passive SP bumps up. Which, lets face it - are terrible options for someone already on the fence. In fact...reason 3 sounds a bit like the 'Neural Remap' that is in EvE. Tired of training combat skills and want to get into business? Remap, and those new skills (and that new play experience) come much more quickly.
Sirys Lyons Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 24	Posted - 2014.01.11 21:46:00 - [5] - Quote Roy Ventus wrote: As someone who would spec into the same crap he had, a respec would be more than fine if they had one with the new suit stats and bonuses. It's not about stupid-people who specced into logis to get the "slayer" advantage but about players who went into a suit because of a specific role and possibly have to change. Some people wanted to have max DPS and had to go into Assaults(which seemed logical) but if Commandos get the max DPS, players will want to go into Commandos(although it's a specialized role >.>). Some people got into a specific logi suit just for the stats but now with the bonuses, they might want to spec into Caldari if they love nanohives and injectors or Minmatar for the reps or Gallente for the scans. People who went into assaults because the scouts weren't up to par and now that the scouts are getting just a little bit of love, they would want to change. People who got out of heavies because they didn't have their racial variant or actually because they were nerfed, would want to go into them now. I could go on and on and on. Just a respec for dropsuit related skills. Nothing too much. Agreed. Maybe one a year. But as it is, there are so many substantial changes happening that it might make the game more fun if players were given the freedom to re-select their destiny, now that their destiny may have changed. Want to save the respec? Sure, do it. Want to use it, and spec back into the exact same thing because you are super hardcore and want the challenge? Sure, do it. The choice is yours...I just want to make a choice when most of the options are actually in front of me, and no-one is going to turn around and say "Oh, sorry about your LV5 in [insert skill here]. That [weapon/module/suit] is now [absolutely god awful / now going to play very differently than you thought]."
Sirys Lyons Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 24	Posted - 2014.01.11 21:48:00 - [6] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: Roy Ventus wrote: Just a respec for dropsuit related skills. Nothing too much. As a wise man once said, sometimes you want grilled cheese sandwich but if that gets nerfed you want the tomato soup. Unless, of course, shortly after being delivered your grilled cheese, it turns into a ham sandwich. Point in case.
Sirys Lyons Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 24	Posted - 2014.01.11 22:34:00 - [7] - Quote Ghermard-ol Dizeriois wrote: Just like with new tanks, CCP gave back the SP everybody spent on vehicles, so the most reasonable thing to do is to offer a RESPEC at least for the ARMOR branch. If they don't... ok, they'll handle everyone raging here! As much as I support ocassional respecs, there is something very important to understand here. CCP gave the refund for vehicle skills because they rebuilt the vehicle skill trees - they completely altered them, so there was no way for them to "reapply" the SP people had already spent. They did not give the refund because of changes to the vehicles themselves. (Personally, changing core gameplay for a group of players...good reason for respec.)
Sirys Lyons Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 30	Posted - 2014.01.11 23:05:00 - [8] - Quote BMSTUBBY wrote: Sirys Lyons wrote: Rasatsu wrote: Roy Ventus wrote: Just a respec for dropsuit related skills. Nothing too much. As a wise man once said, sometimes you want grilled cheese sandwich but if that gets nerfed you want the tomato soup. Unless, of course, shortly after being delivered your grilled cheese, it turns into a ham sandwich. Point in case. I am not sure what is for dinner yet. It really is hard to say.