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daishi mk03
Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic
316
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Posted - 2013.11.08 11:28:00 -
[1] - Quote
Idea: Only suits, weapons, equipment, vehicles and modules of meta level 6 and below are allowed to be used in standard battles (ambush, skirmish, domination). FW is not affected.
Advantages: Those battles are right now the place for newer players, solo non-proto players, low level squads and ALL of Dust University (who are really the biggest noobs in this game, ALL of them). It is not productive to let them face maxed out squads who will redline them in seconds or massacre them in ambush.
What will change: Not much, since a maxed squad will also win with ADV gear. However, chances are better that a newish player will win a firefight against one of them, though a Dust University player will certainly NOT. Also, proto-level squads might be encouraged to fight in FW, where they can run all their stuff.
Technical Implementation: Just disable all suits which are meta level 7+ or contain parts with meta level 7+.
Will Dust University ever be viable? I'm sorry, no. |
Matticus Monk
Ordus Trismegistus
666
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Posted - 2013.11.08 12:13:00 -
[2] - Quote
I'd really like an idea like this implemented.
I think there needs to be a place to run even lower gear as well, though; some sort of buffer area using standard and below gear. Someplace between the Academy and the ADV playground you describe.
I'm not sure if this is a separate way to differentiate public contract battles, or maybe even another battle arena... but newbs will get wrecked and stomped almost as badly by vets in ADV gear with ADV weapons if there isn't another place.
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Echoist
Fenrir's Wolves Zero-Day
89
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Posted - 2013.11.08 12:23:00 -
[3] - Quote
Hell yes I agree with this all the way.
P.S. what's your beef with DU? |
Text Grant
Death Firm.
197
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Posted - 2013.11.08 12:30:00 -
[4] - Quote
Matticus Monk wrote:I'd really like an idea like this implemented.
I think there needs to be a place to run even lower gear as well, though; some sort of buffer area using standard and below gear. Someplace between the Academy and the ADV playground you describe.
I'm not sure if this is a separate way to differentiate public contract battles, or maybe even another battle arena... but newbs will get wrecked and stomped almost as badly by vets in ADV gear with ADV weapons if there isn't another place.
Lower sounds great. But to be fair it should limit isk rewards. (Same SP gain) |
Keri Starlight
0uter.Heaven Proficiency V.
1854
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Posted - 2013.11.08 12:44:00 -
[5] - Quote
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1404693#post1404693
You can read my opinions on this subject in this thread. Check my first reply.
-Caldari Achura - One with the Universe
-Tac AR Specialist
"I load my gun with love instead of bullets"
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lrian Locust
DUST University Ivy League
279
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Posted - 2013.11.08 15:23:00 -
[6] - Quote
daishi mk03 wrote:(...)ALL of Dust University (who are really the biggest noobs in this game, ALL of them). (...) chances are better that a newish player will win a firefight against one of them, though a Dust University player will certainly NOT. (...) Will Dust University ever be viable? I'm sorry, no. You really like making friends, don't you? :)
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Awry Barux
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
296
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Posted - 2013.11.08 16:15:00 -
[7] - Quote
This idea won't work, for one simple reason. Complex damage mods are meta 4. |
Takron Nistrom
Tinfoil Hatz
122
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Posted - 2013.11.08 16:50:00 -
[8] - Quote
You dont need to limit meta levels. Just limit access to public matches by KDR. I enjoy using proto gear but Im far from a pub stomper. If you want to limit stomps, just limit by KDR
GÇ£Pulvis et umbra sumus. (We are but dust and shadow.)GÇ¥
GÇò Horace, The Odes of Horace
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daishi mk03
Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic
319
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Posted - 2013.11.08 17:08:00 -
[9] - Quote
Awry Barux wrote:This idea won't work, for one simple reason. Complex damage mods are meta 4.
Easy. Make them level 8 and fine.
1-3 MLT/STD (Basic) 4-6 ADV (Enh) 7-9 Proto (Comp)
Also, most proto stompers don't have ADV fits and are most likely not able to make them. So they have to go FW. |
Talos Vagheitan
154
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Posted - 2013.11.08 17:22:00 -
[10] - Quote
http://postimg.org/image/5uox4u9av/ http://postimg.org/image/gt06n0xw7/
Someone recently posted these pics of a severely mismatched game. Brutal, and we've all been there.
Now my question to you is, if both of these teams were forced to play with the same gear, do you think the result would have been any different?
The main difference between these two teams is experience. The team on the right, are good players to start with, are familiar with the game, and use teamwork as they are all in squads. The full proto gear is just the icing on the cake. But all of those things come with experience!
I would guess the average SP of the team on the right 15-25 Mill SP of the team on the left <10 Mill
If Scotty tried to sort teams by SP that would hopefully have placed one of those super squads on the other team, in exchange for blueberries.
Limiting gear in pub matches will change nothing.
Who cares what some sniper has to say
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Zeylon Rho
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
3023
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Posted - 2013.11.08 17:25:00 -
[11] - Quote
The meta levels on a lot of items are borked currently.
I'd like the idea of STD-tier (meta 3 tops?) battle restrictions, etc. Some people apparently take issue with the idea of ever having any restrictions, but I think having stuff like that would add a little variety to the game modes as well. High-sec STD-meta pub matches could make sense, after all.. there's tons of things that are considered illegal in High-sec space. Prototype weaponry, etc. easily be part of that list.
Join my cult.
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daishi mk03
Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic
319
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Posted - 2013.11.08 17:27:00 -
[12] - Quote
@Talos Vagheitan Read under "What will change". I said it won't change the outcome of the match ... why you telling me this? |
Zeylon Rho
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
3023
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Posted - 2013.11.08 17:33:00 -
[13] - Quote
Talos Vagheitan wrote:http://postimg.org/image/5uox4u9av/ http://postimg.org/image/gt06n0xw7/Someone recently posted these pics of a severely mismatched game. Brutal, and we've all been there. Now my question to you is, if both of these teams were forced to play with the same gear, do you think the result would have been any different? The main difference between these two teams is experience. The team on the right, are good players to start with, are familiar with the game, and use teamwork as they are all in squads. The full proto gear is just the icing on the cake. But all of those things come with experience! I would guess the average SP of the team on the right 15-25 Mill SP of the team on the left <10 Mill If Scotty tried to sort teams by SP that would hopefully have placed one of those super squads on the other team, in exchange for blueberries. Limiting gear in pub matches will change nothing.
This is just silly.
Let's take two players:
A) Guy can run proto gear, and has the means to do so: Proficiency 5, etc.
B) Newer player that has the SP to run an advanced assault suit, and has a weapon to PRO but no proficiency
Scenario 1 Duvolle AR + DMG Mods and Tank in PRO suit guy attacks the 2nd Guy with a Gek in his STD suit (doesn't run the advanced suit for financial reasons)
Scenario 2 Exile AR + Whatever vs. Standard AR and whatever.
Does the vet have the advantage in both scenarios? Yes.
Does he have less of an advantage when he doesn't have skills + proto gear by default? ******* YES!!
Sure, experience and skill bonuses account for a huge chunk of the advantage of a veteran players, but to say gear does literally nothing is just asinine and ignorant.
The fact it makes for a slight set of differences as opposed to being a complete game-changer is one of the better cases for implementing it actually.
Join my cult.
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Keri Starlight
0uter.Heaven Proficiency V.
1874
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Posted - 2013.11.08 18:40:00 -
[14] - Quote
Takron Nistrom wrote:You dont need to limit meta levels. Just limit access to public matches by KDR. I enjoy using proto gear but Im far from a pub stomper. If you want to limit stomps, just limit by KDR
So what am I supposed to play? PC 24/7?
-Caldari Achura - One with the Universe
-Tac AR Specialist
"I load my gun with love instead of bullets"
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Takron Nistrom
Tinfoil Hatz
122
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Posted - 2013.11.09 01:20:00 -
[15] - Quote
Keri Starlight wrote:Takron Nistrom wrote:You dont need to limit meta levels. Just limit access to public matches by KDR. I enjoy using proto gear but Im far from a pub stomper. If you want to limit stomps, just limit by KDR So what am I supposed to play? PC 24/7?
FW
GÇ£Pulvis et umbra sumus. (We are but dust and shadow.)GÇ¥
GÇò Horace, The Odes of Horace
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Draco Cerberus
Hell's Gate Inc
474
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Posted - 2013.11.09 02:00:00 -
[16] - Quote
Zeylon Rho wrote: This is just silly.
Let's take two players:
A) Guy can run proto gear, and has the means to do so: Proficiency 5, etc.
B) Newer player that has the SP to run an advanced assault suit, and has a weapon to PRO but no proficiency
Scenario 1 Duvolle AR + DMG Mods and Tank in PRO suit guy attacks the 2nd Guy with a Gek in his STD suit (doesn't run the advanced suit for financial reasons)
Scenario 2 Exile AR + Whatever vs. Standard AR and whatever.
Does the vet have the advantage in both scenarios? Yes.
Does he have less of an advantage when he doesn't have skills + proto gear by default? ******* YES!!
Sure, experience and skill bonuses account for a huge chunk of the advantage of a veteran players, but to say gear does literally nothing is just asinine and ignorant.
The fact it makes for a slight set of differences as opposed to being a complete game-changer is one of the better cases for implementing it actually.
So life is always fair right? When the Japanese and Americans were fighting in WWII as soon as the Americans built an Atomic Bomb they said to themselves, lets give this to the Japanese so they can fight on an even playing field, right? Wrong.
This is not a game where everyone is meant to be equal. It is meant to be varying skill level vs varying skill level. It is meant to reward the person who out thinks his opponent. This is a game that mirrors our own lives with a future spin on things. It is not meant to be fair. Risk == ISK, the Proto users risk lots of Isk for a bigger payout, it is as simple as that. If you can't handle the heat get out of the fire...I think that is the reason for the leave battle option.
One Universe...with friendly fire for all!
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