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Getting Ready for the New Eden Economy

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Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 4461	Posted - 2013.10.10 17:57:00 - [1] - Quote As you all know, Dust 514 is expected to have an Eve Online style economy sometime around 2014 at the latest (this is my prediction given the current rate of progress). For those of you who never played Eve Online nor heard about it, here is a list of what usually goes down in the New Eden economy in an easy-to-follow step-by-step process. 1. Player A is mining asteroids in space. 2. Player A refines the ore gathered from the asteroids into minerals and sells the minerals to Player B. 3. Player B used the minerals purchased to manufacture a mining ship and a battlecruiser. 4. Player B sells the battlecruiser to Player C who then uses it to do mission running and sells off any loot that he has to Player D. 5. Player C gets bored and decides to suicide gank Player A in high-sec space. 6. Player A loses his mining ship while Player C loses his battlecruiser after Concord (in-game police) nukes him to hell. 7. Player A buys a new mining ship from Player B. 8. Player C buys a new battlecruiser from Player B. 9. In the meantime, Player D is busy buying mission loot from different players like Player C and selling them at marked up prices to other players like Player C who might need ammo and stuff to do their missions or to gank players. 10. Players D learns the art of mastering market manipulation and manages to gain a temporary (but profitable) monopoly in the regional market for ammo. 11. Player C finds himself having to spend more ISK than usual trying to purchase the same amount of ammo as before. 12. Player E comes into the region and sees Player D is overcharging on an ammo. 13. Player E takes advantage of this by selling the same ammo at lower prices thus undercutting Player D. 14. Not wanting to lose a customer, Player D decides to lower his selling prices to match the better offer. 15. Players D and E enter a loop of near-endless price matching until one of them calls it quits and moves to something else. 16. In the meantime, Player C benefits from seeing cheaper ammo during the loop... until the winner of the loop marks up the prices again. 17. Player C joins other players like him and goes on a rampage killing miners in high-sec while conspiring with people like Players B, D and E to mark up the prices of mining ships accordingly. 18. People like Player A find themselves constantly under attack and constantly overpaying for the same equipment they once got for cheap. That's just the tip of the iceberg of what to expect. Here are a few things you folks should be doing right now since you have almost a whole year to prepare for. 1. Purchase BPOs whenever you can or stick to ISK-variant militia gear to save up on ISK. 2. Use that extra ISK to stock up on as much gear as you can (buy them by the hundreds per module). When the New Eden economy hits, you will be prepared with a nice stockpile of now-expensive gear that you once got for cheap. You then have two options. Sell them all to take advantage of the momentary price hike or continue using them without worrying about running out of fits anytime soon. Keep in mind that in this New Eden economy, all transactions will be between two players (one buy and one seller) with the occasional NPC broker fees charged to the seller. This will ensure that no new ISK enters the economy outside of public contracts while the ISK simply exchanges hands between players. After a while, the price hike will settle down on its own thanks to the basic economic laws of supply and demand. And by "a while" I mean a few weeks to a few months. The prices will settle once players figure out how to effectively and efficiently mass produce certain gear in bulk.
Awry Barux Shining Flame Amarr Empire 164	Posted - 2013.10.10 17:59:00 - [2] - Quote Cool post, thanks for the primer. Any word on whether BPOs will be sellable?
Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK 190	Posted - 2013.10.10 18:07:00 - [3] - Quote Shhhh maken, not so loud, CCP will hear. They've already toned downn isk pay outs because there is too much sitting in reserve waiting to get spent. Also part of the reason on why easy access BPOs don't exist anymore. Ill agree to a market in the pseudo near future tho.
Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 1744	Posted - 2013.10.10 18:50:00 - [4] - Quote Alliance A sits on PC districts for months. Player market is introduced. Alliance A gains complete monopoly of the market. Rest of Dust B cannot afford anything anymore. B leaves, A sits proud on a desolate throne.
pyramidhead 420 Carbon 7 CRONOS. 79	Posted - 2013.10.10 19:06:00 - [5] - Quote i have an isk minting machine (cant say where i got it , but know player a, b, c, d, e, f, g, h, would kill their own family to get it)
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 5343	Posted - 2013.11.27 04:11:00 - [6] - Quote Updated the OP to reflect the fact that BPOs are no longer available to purchase from the market. That should clear up any confusion. Anyways, this is something you all should read again as a reminder of what you're getting yourselves into once the economy opens up. Better start stockpiling. Your loss if you don't. CCP, thank you for hotfixing the knives. But please make sure they're at their full potential in 1.7.
Ludvig Enraga KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 684	Posted - 2013.11.27 04:17:00 - [7] - Quote Or there is player X who lives in a developing country, runs an EvE bot on his PC and farms ISK by killing NPC in nullsec like it's his job.... wait.... it is his day job. Then he floods EvE economy with cheap isk. You know, much like you would by running pubs AFK all day. Oh, sht! I just learned you can make a signature! Thanks, CCP! Forums are getting better!
Viktor Hadah Jr Critical-Impact 1240	Posted - 2013.11.27 04:19:00 - [8] - Quote tbh i am sure they will not get rid of the current items sold on market they will keep them all same price but they will allow players to sell their modules for below npc market price to other players. you will still be able to buy everything at standard price if no player is selling at the moment. For the Empire Dual tanking is a sin BPO's are bad for economy, Respec's are bad for the game. Want to fight about it?
XANDER KAG Red Star. EoN. 529	Posted - 2013.11.27 04:26:00 - [9] - Quote This kids, is why I kept stockpiling BPO's if they go industrial or stay as they are I win either way . Who says you can't kill in style? When CCP plays Dust514
mollerz Minja Scouts 955	Posted - 2013.11.27 04:26:00 - [10] - Quote I've been a keen speculator this entire time. There were certain items outside the BPO item list that were pretty awesome to stockpile. As long time players there were many opportunities to buy items in ways that won't be possible again. Hacked ADV AV nades, SAGA 2s, Charged sniper rifles, etc. BPO suits will be pretty valuable going forward as well as officer weapons. But Mac, are you thinking items like duvolles will become super inflated? compact nanohives? Also, consider CCP can easily dictate markets until they settle. Just flood the markets with NPC supplied bids.

dustwaffle Xer Cloud Consortium 686	Posted - 2013.11.27 04:46:00 - [11] - Quote Chunky Munkey wrote: Alliance A sits on PC districts for months. Player market is introduced. Alliance A gains complete monopoly of the market. Rest of Dust B cannot afford anything anymore. B leaves, A sits proud on a desolate throne. Player 'C M' doesn't understand basic economics and makes a post of the forums.
TheAmazing FlyingPig Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 4700	Posted - 2013.11.27 04:54:00 - [12] - Quote inb4 CCP resets assets and refunds ISK. Never forget How to fix the Logi
Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 2348	Posted - 2013.11.27 05:23:00 - [13] - Quote dustwaffle wrote: Chunky Munkey wrote: Alliance A sits on PC districts for months. Player market is introduced. Alliance A gains complete monopoly of the market. Rest of Dust B cannot afford anything anymore. B leaves, A sits proud on a desolate throne. Player 'C M' doesn't understand basic economics and makes a post of the forums. Lol, by all means tell me what part of basic economics I missed. No.
dustwaffle Xer Cloud Consortium 686	Posted - 2013.11.27 05:30:00 - [14] - Quote Chunky Munkey wrote: dustwaffle wrote: Chunky Munkey wrote: Alliance A sits on PC districts for months. Player market is introduced. Alliance A gains complete monopoly of the market. Rest of Dust B cannot afford anything anymore. B leaves, A sits proud on a desolate throne. Player 'C M' doesn't understand basic economics and makes a post of the forums. Lol, by all means tell me what part of basic economics I missed. Supply and demand
JL3Eleven 1265	Posted - 2013.11.27 05:32:00 - [15] - Quote dustwaffle wrote: Chunky Munkey wrote: dustwaffle wrote: Chunky Munkey wrote: Alliance A sits on PC districts for months. Player market is introduced. Alliance A gains complete monopoly of the market. Rest of Dust B cannot afford anything anymore. B leaves, A sits proud on a desolate throne. Player 'C M' doesn't understand basic economics and makes a post of the forums. Lol, by all means tell me what part of basic economics I missed. Supply and demand lolwut? LAV Dealer Dust 514 started from the bottom now we here.
Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 2348	Posted - 2013.11.27 05:42:00 - [16] - Quote dustwaffle wrote: Chunky Munkey wrote: dustwaffle wrote: Chunky Munkey wrote: Alliance A sits on PC districts for months. Player market is introduced. Alliance A gains complete monopoly of the market. Rest of Dust B cannot afford anything anymore. B leaves, A sits proud on a desolate throne. Player 'C M' doesn't understand basic economics and makes a post of the forums. Lol, by all means tell me what part of basic economics I missed. Supply and demand Alliance A benefits if Rest of Dust B is not well supplied genius. "basic economics" No.
Assert Dominance Ahrendee's Wafflehouse 479	Posted - 2013.11.27 05:50:00 - [17] - Quote Chunky Munkey wrote: Alliance A sits on PC districts for months. Player market is introduced. Alliance A gains complete monopoly of the market. Rest of Dust B cannot afford anything anymore. B leaves, A sits proud on a desolate throne. basically I eat blue waffles when i proto stomp.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 5347	Posted - 2013.11.27 06:35:00 - [18] - Quote Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: tbh i am sure they will not get rid of the current items sold on market they will keep them all same price but they will allow players to sell their modules for below npc market price to other players. you will still be able to buy everything at standard price if no player is selling at the moment. I expect the following if CCP is going down the Eve Online route of economics: Npc items seed the market for at first with a set price but with limited supply. Just enough for so that Eve players manufacture enough bulk to replace them. In the meantime, players can decide what price to set regardless how much the npc items are selling for. Once npc stock runs out, market temporarily fluctuates until a sustainable supply of said items are constantly produced by the players. That's what I predict is going to happen. You're not gonna like it at first, but then you start warming up to it as you adapt your fighting habits to conserve gear and start doing PVE missions or get better pay after selling factional warfare gear you acquired from the LP store. In the meantime you'll then start to want to do market pvp in addition to battlefield pvp to supplement your income. CCP, thank you for hotfixing the knives. But please make sure they're at their full potential in 1.7.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 5347	Posted - 2013.11.27 06:39:00 - [19] - Quote Market pvp is actually quite fun if you think about it. Constantly undercutting your opponents in an attempt to steal their regular customers. If you do it right, you might even get a temporary monopoly on the region and experience a brief but glorious source of revenue until someone else comes in to take your customers. CCP, thank you for hotfixing the knives. But please make sure they're at their full potential in 1.7.
Jacques Cayton II Providence Guard Templis Dragonaors 126	Posted - 2013.11.27 07:07:00 - [20] - Quote I have 20 bpo's and eventually I'm going to sell them for 10 mil each We fight for the future of the State not our personal goals

Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 2352	Posted - 2013.11.27 08:56:00 - [21] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: I have 20 bpo's and eventually I'm going to sell them for 10 mil each Given CCP's current feelings towards BPOs, it's unlikely they'll allow them to be traded as freely as any other items. No.
Sgt Kirk SyNergy Gaming EoN. 3053	Posted - 2013.11.27 09:11:00 - [22] - Quote Player Sgt Kirk shoots down all ships within a 17 mile radius from surface of my planet, profiting from the rare "earth" material mining industry, uncontested.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 5349	Posted - 2013.11.27 13:09:00 - [23] - Quote Chunky Munkey wrote: Jacques Cayton II wrote: I have 20 bpo's and eventually I'm going to sell them for 10 mil each Given CCP's current feelings towards BPOs, it's unlikely they'll allow them to be traded as freely as any other items. Given that the tech 2 BPOs in Eve online are still tradable, it's still likely that CCP will allow it. CCP, thank you for hotfixing the knives. But please make sure they're at their full potential in 1.7.
Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 2359	Posted - 2013.11.27 18:52:00 - [24] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Chunky Munkey wrote: Jacques Cayton II wrote: I have 20 bpo's and eventually I'm going to sell them for 10 mil each Given CCP's current feelings towards BPOs, it's unlikely they'll allow them to be traded as freely as any other items. Given that the tech 2 BPOs in Eve online are still tradable, it's still likely that CCP will allow it. Aren't they quite different from BPOs in Dust? No.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 5354	Posted - 2013.11.27 18:58:00 - [25] - Quote Chunky Munkey wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Chunky Munkey wrote: Jacques Cayton II wrote: I have 20 bpo's and eventually I'm going to sell them for 10 mil each Given CCP's current feelings towards BPOs, it's unlikely they'll allow them to be traded as freely as any other items. Given that the tech 2 BPOs in Eve online are still tradable, it's still likely that CCP will allow it. Aren't they quite different from BPOs in Dust? Only two noticeable differences. Tech 2 BPOs require minerals to use and they only cost ISK. However, just like BPOs in DUST, they are novelty items since they are no longer made available by CCP (they were lottery items) and they have helped their respective owners gain very powerful positions in the production market. Surprisingly they don't have any negative effect on the Eve economy mainly because of the invention process established later on. CCP, thank you for hotfixing the knives. But please make sure they're at their full potential in 1.7.
Flix Keptick Red Star. EoN. 1413	Posted - 2013.11.27 19:07:00 - [26] - Quote I am not too worried right now cause I have soooo much unused modules "HP needs no buff, certain weapons need nerf. Or else all other become obsolete." GÿåForum warrior lvl.1Gÿå
Fox Gaden Bojo's School of the Trades 1629	Posted - 2013.11.27 19:15:00 - [27] - Quote It will not come all at once. We will get a DUST only market first which will allow us to sell our salvage, and for people with $ to sell AUM items for ISK. Other complexities of the market, and eventual EVE/DUST integration of the market will happen in future iterations. CCPGÇÖs intention had been to eventually have production of DUST gear done on the EVE side. This plan may change though. It will likely depend on what the players want. Renier Gaden: CEO of Immortal Guides Fox Gaden: TCO & TMO for BSotT Crash Gaden: Operations Director, Immortal Guide
Luk Manag of Terror TRE GAFFEL 184	Posted - 2013.11.27 20:02:00 - [28] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: I have 20 bpo's and eventually I'm going to sell them for 10 mil each Depending on the suit or item - 100 mil wouldn't be surprising. There will be bullets. ACR+SMG
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 5357	Posted - 2013.11.27 23:57:00 - [29] - Quote Luk Manag wrote: Jacques Cayton II wrote: I have 20 bpo's and eventually I'm going to sell them for 10 mil each Depending on the suit or item - 100 mil wouldn't be surprising. A Thale sniper rifle would probably fetch for at least 10 million and that's not including its bpo equivalent. Yes, there are Thale BPOs out there. Only nine are known to exist according to an anonymous source and they were only made available for a limited time during closed beta. Imagine the value of that little gem. Suddenly 1 billion ISK doesn't sound to bad for that kind of bpo. CCP, thank you for hotfixing the knives. But please make sure they're at their full potential in 1.7.
Leithe Askarii Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 44	Posted - 2013.11.27 23:59:00 - [30] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Luk Manag wrote: Jacques Cayton II wrote: I have 20 bpo's and eventually I'm going to sell them for 10 mil each Depending on the suit or item - 100 mil wouldn't be surprising. A Thale sniper rifle would probably fetch for at least 10 million and that's not including its bpo equivalent. Yes, there are Thale BPOs out there. Only nine are known to exist according to an anonymous source and they were only made available for a limited time during closed beta. Imagine the value of that little gem. Suddenly 1 billion ISK doesn't sound to bad for that kind of bpo. More if you are right.



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