DUST Search - Enforcer Tanks, decent or worthless?

Thumb Green wrote:

Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote:

Thumb Green wrote:

They're better than people give them credit for. I had Fenix Vael of PFB in my squad a good while back and he has a pretty good Vayu. Got 4 OB's in one match just from the squad members in the tank and he didn't lose a single tank in that match even though at least half the team switched to AV and was trying to kill us; but that was before the LAV spam got real heavy causing everybody & their mother to skill into proto AV. However InsertCoinHere of 0uter.Heaven just posted a video the other day of his squad in a Falchion wrecking the enemy team.

So, the tanks are fine. It's the tank crews that suck.

What you just stated was a match with NO ADV OR PROTO AV WEAPONS... I can't believe how ignorant some people are. Yes they can happen! Just like once every...... 30-40 rounds.

One player with proto and a Nanohive can get into a position so that no matter what the tank does it'll die. One guy in 70k ISK of gear, vs 500k + of tank. It's not that hard... in fact it's absurdly easy to do. I do it all the time. Oh there's a tank... get behind it.. it reps and armors up... DEAD before reaching cover.

You either have to be in denial or a "special education" student to think otherwise.

No, you have to be in denial or a "special education" student to think that it should take Advanced or Prototype AV (or even worse as a lot of tankers seem to think, a whole squad of Advanced or Prototype AV) to take out Standard tanks. That's how it is now, you need Advanced or Proto to take out a Standard tank. Try it with Standard AV and 3 guys would have to chase the tank all over the map to kill it. When all it takes is a guy in 0 isk BPO gear to kill a guy in 200+ isk proto.

Pfft, you guys are complaining about the wrong thing.

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The Propaganda Panda SLiK Gaming 0	Posted - 2013.09.09 14:12:00 - [1] - Quote I have been debating for a while now whether to invest my sp into the enforcer tanks, I have speced a lot into tank modules etc and have been thinking about enforcer tanks but from what I can gather from the info on the market place there is ZERO difference between them and the original? Apart from the fact they're 1mil isk more. Is this the case or are they actually a lot more effective than they seem on paper?
Sgt Buttscratch SLAPHAPPY BANDITS 733	Posted - 2013.09.09 14:15:00 - [2] - Quote they are between MLT and STD. Worthless junk, the only reason you see falchions out there is cuz that event
Void Echo Morsus Mihi Aperuitque Imperium 1282	Posted - 2013.09.09 14:16:00 - [3] - Quote worthless, the attributes they give contradict each other and are nearly useless in terms of tanks. they were only implemented because infantry wanted us to use them. guess what, we don't use them
Lorhak Gannarsein Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 302	Posted - 2013.09.09 14:17:00 - [4] - Quote Unless you're going all the way, probably don't touch the Vayu. The Falchion is more useful, thanks to the extra low, but in the end, you're probably better off saving that 1M. In any event, if you unlock Falchion, don't go further unless you REALLY like missiles. Actually, should have been first question: armour or shield?
shaman oga Nexus Balusa Horizon DARKSTAR ARMY 597	Posted - 2013.09.09 14:19:00 - [5] - Quote They would be somehow usefull if they cost like the STD, but only because of their 3rd slot and the bonus. As they are now the cons beat the pros. 1) Insane cost 2) Speed penalty 3) Less pg/cpu They also attract more AV than regular tanks
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1254	Posted - 2013.09.09 14:25:00 - [6] - Quote Worthless Too much SP/ISK for an advanced milita hull 'Long range bombardment' lolmissiles are medium at best and lolblaster CQC range Only the Falchion i could and would skill into if i had to because i do enjoy lolmissiles but atm waiting to see how 1.5 pans out
Monkey MAC killer taxi company General Tso's Alliance 335	Posted - 2013.09.09 14:29:00 - [7] - Quote Void Echo wrote: worthless, the attributes they give contradict each other and are nearly useless in terms of tanks. they were only implemented because infantry wanted us to use them. guess what, we don't use them You really have it in for the infantry dont you??
grunt party Carbon 7 CRONOS. 26	Posted - 2013.09.09 14:40:00 - [8] - Quote don't bother they are useless
MarasdF Loron Dark Knightz Corp. 127	Posted - 2013.09.09 14:49:00 - [9] - Quote You used to be able to make Falchion nigh unkillable with LLAV backing you up but with the buff to swarms and nerf to LLAVs (LLAVs can no longer see when they need to rep you, thus making the LOGI part useless) they have become very expensive coffins as they cannot get away from anything due to their insanely low speed. Vayus have always been a big f*cking joke.
Thumb Green Novashift 379	Posted - 2013.09.09 14:59:00 - [10] - Quote They're better than people give them credit for. I had Fenix Vael of PFB in my squad a good while back and he has a pretty good Vayu. Got 4 OB's in one match just from the squad members in the tank and he didn't lose a single tank in that match even though at least half the team switched to AV and was trying to kill us; but that was before the LAV spam got real heavy causing everybody & their mother to skill into proto AV. However InsertCoinHere of 0uter.Heaven just posted a video the other day of his squad in a Falchion wrecking the enemy team. So, the tanks are fine. It's the tank crews that suck.

Void Echo Morsus Mihi Aperuitque Imperium 1283	Posted - 2013.09.09 14:59:00 - [11] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Void Echo wrote: worthless, the attributes they give contradict each other and are nearly useless in terms of tanks. they were only implemented because infantry wanted us to use them. guess what, we don't use them You really have it in for the infantry dont you?? they are the reason why we are in a vehicle crisis, I hate them with a passion
Void Echo Morsus Mihi Aperuitque Imperium 1283	Posted - 2013.09.09 15:01:00 - [12] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: They're better than people give them credit for. I had Fenix Vael of PFB in my squad a good while back and he has a pretty good Vayu. Got 4 OB's in one match just from the squad members in the tank and he didn't lose a single tank in that match even though at least half the team switched to AV and was trying to kill us; but that was before the LAV spam got real heavy causing everybody & their mother to skill into proto AV. However InsertCoinHere of 0uter.Heaven just posted a video the other day of his squad in a Falchion wrecking the enemy team. So, the tanks are fine. It's the tank crews that suck. funny how I just killed 5 enforcer tanks 5 minutes ago solo... and im running a madrugar
Thumb Green Novashift 379	Posted - 2013.09.09 15:07:00 - [13] - Quote So, you just took out 5 tanks with crappy crews on your own; congrats on such an astounding feat.
Lurchasaurus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1883	Posted - 2013.09.09 15:07:00 - [14] - Quote they have bonuses to weapon damage, but it is quickly outweighed by their stupidly high costs and lack of CPU/PG when tanks are already hurting to fit decent mods. Tanks currently have a broken balance of risk vs. reward, but this is old news.
Void Echo Morsus Mihi Aperuitque Imperium 1283	Posted - 2013.09.09 15:08:00 - [15] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: So, you just took out 5 tanks with crappy crews on your own; congrats on such an astounding feat. I thought your whole argument was based on the pilots not the crews
The Attorney General ZionTCD 866	Posted - 2013.09.09 15:11:00 - [16] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: They're better than people give them credit for. I had Fenix Vael of PFB in my squad a good while back and he has a pretty good Vayu. Got 4 OB's in one match just from the squad members in the tank and he didn't lose a single tank in that match even though at least half the team switched to AV and was trying to kill us; but that was before the LAV spam got real heavy causing everybody & their mother to skill into proto AV. However InsertCoinHere of 0uter.Heaven just posted a video the other day of his squad in a Falchion wrecking the enemy team. So, the tanks are fine. It's the tank crews that suck. As it stands, if you were to use a Flachion or Vayu with a LLAV, you can make them potent. If the enemy team is not terribly smart, or are kept under constant enough pressure ot never have a chance to co-ordinate a strike on the tank, you can survive. If you roll a second LLAV, your chances go way up. At the cost of 1.8 million SP to get a meaningful bonus out of it, is it really worth it? I don't think so. The biggest issue with both of them is the movement penalty, followed by the fact that spending 1.8 mill for hte 12% bonus is crazy expensive for what is at best a sideshow attraction. I can run a Vayu with a LLAV and get 50 kills in a skirmish, or 30 in an Ambush. Doesn't mean the tank is good, means I got lucky.
Lorhak Gannarsein Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 302	Posted - 2013.09.09 15:12:00 - [17] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: They're better than people give them credit for. I had Fenix Vael of PFB in my squad a good while back and he has a pretty good Vayu. Got 4 OB's in one match just from the squad members in the tank and he didn't lose a single tank in that match even though at least half the team switched to AV and was trying to kill us; but that was before the LAV spam got real heavy causing everybody & their mother to skill into proto AV. However InsertCoinHere of 0uter.Heaven just posted a video the other day of his squad in a Falchion wrecking the enemy team. So, the tanks are fine. It's the tank crews that suck. And they'd have been much more effective if they'd been sensible and used a Madrugar instead of the Vayu. Which only comes into its own after sinking 4M into the skill to cap it.
Thumb Green Novashift 379	Posted - 2013.09.09 15:28:00 - [18] - Quote Void Echo wrote: Thumb Green wrote: So, you just took out 5 tanks with crappy crews on your own; congrats on such an astounding feat. I thought your whole argument was based on the pilots not the crews You don't read very well do you? Go over it again, the only point I referenced a pilot by himself was when I said "he didn't lose a single tank". However if those 5 tanks you took out only had a pilot then I must congratulate you even more for such a difficult task.
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1254	Posted - 2013.09.09 15:34:00 - [19] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: They're better than people give them credit for. I had Fenix Vael of PFB in my squad a good while back and he has a pretty good Vayu. Got 4 OB's in one match just from the squad members in the tank and he didn't lose a single tank in that match even though at least half the team switched to AV and was trying to kill us; but that was before the LAV spam got real heavy causing everybody & their mother to skill into proto AV. However InsertCoinHere of 0uter.Heaven just posted a video the other day of his squad in a Falchion wrecking the enemy team. So, the tanks are fine. It's the tank crews that suck. 1 match lol its fine guys it really is even tho it has less PG/CPU costs more ISK/SP and is only useful for CQC combat where proto AV will tear you up and basic vehicles will kill you easily I bet it was an ambush match as well
Void Echo Morsus Mihi Aperuitque Imperium 1283	Posted - 2013.09.09 15:35:00 - [20] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: Void Echo wrote: Thumb Green wrote: So, you just took out 5 tanks with crappy crews on your own; congrats on such an astounding feat. I thought your whole argument was based on the pilots not the crews You don't read very well do you? Go over it again, the only point I referenced a pilot by himself was when I said "he didn't lose a single tank". However if those 5 tanks you took out only had a pilot then I must congratulate you even more for such a difficult task. when your going against AV, everything iss nearly impossibe

Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 73	Posted - 2013.09.09 15:43:00 - [21] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: They're better than people give them credit for. I had Fenix Vael of PFB in my squad a good while back and he has a pretty good Vayu. Got 4 OB's in one match just from the squad members in the tank and he didn't lose a single tank in that match even though at least half the team switched to AV and was trying to kill us; but that was before the LAV spam got real heavy causing everybody & their mother to skill into proto AV. However InsertCoinHere of 0uter.Heaven just posted a video the other day of his squad in a Falchion wrecking the enemy team. So, the tanks are fine. It's the tank crews that suck. What you just stated was a match with NO ADV OR PROTO AV WEAPONS... I can't believe how ignorant some people are. Yes they can happen! Just like once every...... 30-40 rounds. One player with proto and a Nanohive can get into a position so that no matter what the tank does it'll die. One guy in 70k ISK of gear, vs 500k + of tank. It's not that hard... in fact it's absurdly easy to do. I do it all the time. Oh there's a tank... get behind it.. it reps and armors up... DEAD before reaching cover. You either have to be in denial or a "special education" student to think otherwise.
Thumb Green Novashift 379	Posted - 2013.09.09 16:52:00 - [22] - Quote Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote: Thumb Green wrote: They're better than people give them credit for. I had Fenix Vael of PFB in my squad a good while back and he has a pretty good Vayu. Got 4 OB's in one match just from the squad members in the tank and he didn't lose a single tank in that match even though at least half the team switched to AV and was trying to kill us; but that was before the LAV spam got real heavy causing everybody & their mother to skill into proto AV. However InsertCoinHere of 0uter.Heaven just posted a video the other day of his squad in a Falchion wrecking the enemy team. So, the tanks are fine. It's the tank crews that suck. What you just stated was a match with NO ADV OR PROTO AV WEAPONS... I can't believe how ignorant some people are. Yes they can happen! Just like once every...... 30-40 rounds. One player with proto and a Nanohive can get into a position so that no matter what the tank does it'll die. One guy in 70k ISK of gear, vs 500k + of tank. It's not that hard... in fact it's absurdly easy to do. I do it all the time. Oh there's a tank... get behind it.. it reps and armors up... DEAD before reaching cover. You either have to be in denial or a "special education" student to think otherwise. No, you have to be in denial or a "special education" student to think that it should take Advanced or Prototype AV (or even worse as a lot of tankers seem to think, a whole squad of Advanced or Prototype AV) to take out Standard tanks. That's how it is now, you need Advanced or Proto to take out a Standard tank. Try it with Standard AV and 3 guys would have to chase the tank all over the map to kill it. When all it takes is a guy in 0 isk BPO gear to kill a guy in 200+ isk proto. Pfft, you guys are complaining about the wrong thing.
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1257	Posted - 2013.09.09 17:08:00 - [23] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote: Thumb Green wrote: They're better than people give them credit for. I had Fenix Vael of PFB in my squad a good while back and he has a pretty good Vayu. Got 4 OB's in one match just from the squad members in the tank and he didn't lose a single tank in that match even though at least half the team switched to AV and was trying to kill us; but that was before the LAV spam got real heavy causing everybody & their mother to skill into proto AV. However InsertCoinHere of 0uter.Heaven just posted a video the other day of his squad in a Falchion wrecking the enemy team. So, the tanks are fine. It's the tank crews that suck. What you just stated was a match with NO ADV OR PROTO AV WEAPONS... I can't believe how ignorant some people are. Yes they can happen! Just like once every...... 30-40 rounds. One player with proto and a Nanohive can get into a position so that no matter what the tank does it'll die. One guy in 70k ISK of gear, vs 500k + of tank. It's not that hard... in fact it's absurdly easy to do. I do it all the time. Oh there's a tank... get behind it.. it reps and armors up... DEAD before reaching cover. You either have to be in denial or a "special education" student to think otherwise. No, you have to be in denial or a "special education" student to think that it should take Advanced or Prototype AV (or even worse as a lot of tankers seem to think, a whole squad of Advanced or Prototype AV) to take out Standard tanks. That's how it is now, you need Advanced or Proto to take out a Standard tank. Try it with Standard AV and 3 guys would have to chase the tank all over the map to kill it. When all it takes is a guy in 0 isk BPO gear to kill a guy in 200+ isk proto. Pfft, you guys are complaining about the wrong thing. lol thinks Proto/Adv AV is needed Doesnt want to work with std AV and 2 other guys to take out the tank, wants to solo because teamwork isnt needed for AV but is needed for tanks If you need adv/proto to take out basic vehicles then tbh you are just a bad player 2 guys with std AV is good to go, 3 to make sure but like all infantry you want to be a one man army
Thumb Green Novashift 379	Posted - 2013.09.09 17:16:00 - [24] - Quote If teamwork was needed for tanks then it'd be all fine and dandy for teamwork to be needed to take out tanks. But it doesn't so don't get on a high horse about teamwork because majority of tankers would jump down anyone's throat the moment they mentioned tanks should take teamwork. Calling me a bad player is an easy way to dismiss me without presenting a substantial argument.
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 850	Posted - 2013.09.09 17:16:00 - [25] - Quote Falchions are obly worth it if you max them and your missiles out ad they give you an extra low slott for more pg upgrades. I do have a few meaty sccaterd neutron blaster fits and a rail or two with extra dammage mods shield havs are not for new tankers tbh.. save your sp for 1.5 when tge rebalance comes and you will know what hav suits your playstyle.
Spkr4theDead International-Fleet 641	Posted - 2013.09.09 17:25:00 - [26] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Void Echo wrote: worthless, the attributes they give contradict each other and are nearly useless in terms of tanks. they were only implemented because infantry wanted us to use them. guess what, we don't use them You really have it in for the infantry dont you?? None of us wanted the enforcer, at all. None of us wanted our PG nerfed. None of us wanted the PRO accelerated missile / scattered ion cannon / compressed particle cannon made to cost near 1mil ISK each.
Spkr4theDead International-Fleet 641	Posted - 2013.09.09 17:26:00 - [27] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: They're better than people give them credit for. I had Fenix Vael of PFB in my squad a good while back and he has a pretty good Vayu. Got 4 OB's in one match just from the squad members in the tank and he didn't lose a single tank in that match even though at least half the team switched to AV and was trying to kill us; but that was before the LAV spam got real heavy causing everybody & their mother to skill into proto AV. However InsertCoinHere of 0uter.Heaven just posted a video the other day of his squad in a Falchion wrecking the enemy team. So, the tanks are fine. It's the tank crews that suck. It's the other team bringing less than ADV AV that can't take out a tank.
daishi mk03 Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 202	Posted - 2013.09.09 17:27:00 - [28] - Quote Both, vayu and falchion have their niche, in which they outshine STD. Don't let anybody fool you with their qq worthless crap.
Spkr4theDead International-Fleet 641	Posted - 2013.09.09 17:27:00 - [29] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: So, you just took out 5 tanks with crappy crews on your own; congrats on such an astounding feat. I'd like to see you take on 5 tanks and win.
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1257	Posted - 2013.09.09 17:28:00 - [30] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: If teamwork was needed for tanks then it'd be all fine and dandy for teamwork to be needed to take out tanks. But it doesn't so don't get on a high horse about teamwork because majority of tankers would jump down anyone's throat the moment they mentioned tanks should take teamwork. Calling me a bad player is an easy way to dismiss me without presenting a substantial argument. Teamwork is needed Every game adv/proto AV against my basic vehicle Always in a squad Always trying to get new ways to survive Always an uphill struggle Say use teamwork for AV they all jump down my throat Say temp remove adv/proto AV same thing happens, they wont give up the advantage they have because they would have to use teamwork Its really funny, tankers use more teamwork than AV



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