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Why must I be a Math Major

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Aisha Ctarl The Generals EoN. 1127	Posted - 2013.08.27 17:17:00 - [1] - Quote To play DUST? Yes I know how to do it, and I do do it, but why can't modified values when skills or modules that grant bonuses just be shown? For example, if you use a complex damage modifier that grants 10% extra to your weapon's damage value, why not just change that value to the new stat when looking at the info in your fitting...why must I whip out a calculator? It is only a minor annoyance, but it is something I hope to see changed in a future update.
Nguruthos IX Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire 1170	Posted - 2013.08.27 17:19:00 - [2] - Quote No, this Really helps new player experience. Most FPS players are also dedicated mathematicians by profession or hobby and LOVE working all this stuff out instead of playing.
Frank Olson Usul DUST University Ivy League 5	Posted - 2013.08.27 17:19:00 - [3] - Quote +1. Nearly all stats are sown in Eve ... I didn't play it for 3 years now, but I think even stuff like how long does your shield have to recharge to be full if it would start at 0 or stuff like that was shown ... or wasn't it ... hm ... At least EVE showed a lot more information than DUST .... Speaking of which ... did they implement the optimal ranges into the weapon's info-screens yet? I didn't check that for weeks.
Sete Clifton PSU GHOST SYNDICATE DARKSTAR ARMY 303	Posted - 2013.08.27 17:22:00 - [4] - Quote I got my minor in math specifically because I knew this game was coming out. That differential geometry is really coming in handy for once.
SteelDark Knight Imperfects Negative-Feedback 102	Posted - 2013.08.27 17:23:00 - [5] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: To play DUST? Yes I know how to do it, and I do do it, but why can't modified values when skills or modules that grant bonuses just be shown? For example, if you use a complex damage modifier that grants 10% extra to your weapon's damage value, why not just change that value to the new stat when looking at the info in your fitting...why must I whip out a calculator? It is only a minor annoyance, but it is something I hope to see changed in a future update. +1 This is a small quality of life change that would certainly help new players understand the benefit of items as well as penalties in stacking.
Aisha Ctarl The Generals EoN. 1135	Posted - 2013.08.27 17:28:00 - [6] - Quote SteelDark Knight wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: To play DUST? Yes I know how to do it, and I do do it, but why can't modified values when skills or modules that grant bonuses just be shown? For example, if you use a complex damage modifier that grants 10% extra to your weapon's damage value, why not just change that value to the new stat when looking at the info in your fitting...why must I whip out a calculator? It is only a minor annoyance, but it is something I hope to see changed in a future update. +1 This is a small quality of life change that would certainly help new players understand the benefit of items as well as penalties in stacking. I had a friend start playing and one night asked why were all of the modules broken. I responded that they weren't broken and asked him why he thought that. He replied that none of the values ever changed when he fitted modules, so he assumed they were non functional. This would go a long way for new players who A) think the same as my friend did B) don't know how to do the math C) are simply too lazy to do the math
Forlorn Destrier Bullet Cluster 1465	Posted - 2013.08.27 17:31:00 - [7] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: To play DUST? Yes I know how to do it, and I do do it, but why can't modified values when skills or modules that grant bonuses just be shown? For example, if you use a complex damage modifier that grants 10% extra to your weapon's damage value, why not just change that value to the new stat when looking at the info in your fitting...why must I whip out a calculator? It is only a minor annoyance, but it is something I hope to see changed in a future update. Agreed. This happen in Eve and I see no reason it shouldn't be implemented here. I think I remember CCP saying that this is a back burner request, though, while they focus on things more critical to gameplay.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 7790	Posted - 2013.08.27 17:37:00 - [8] - Quote High school algebra is all you really need.
Nguruthos IX Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire 1171	Posted - 2013.08.27 17:40:00 - [9] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: High school algebra is all you really need. Point is High school algebra is what you don't need for pretty much any other game / FPS. So how is that helpful to NPE?
Poonmunch Sanguis Defense Syndicate 224	Posted - 2013.08.27 17:50:00 - [10] - Quote I totally friggin' agree with the OP. Why isn't this just shown on the fittings display or something? The data is obviously there. Algebra? Seriously? I have an engineering degree, so algebra isn't a problem. Who uses algebra these days? That's what computers, spreadsheets and data bases are for. On another note, could we please get an offline app for PC or smartphone so we can play with fittings to see how we can tweak them? Munch

Tuna the Fish The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 82	Posted - 2013.08.27 17:51:00 - [11] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: High school algebra is all you really need. Swing and a miss. Back on topic, another stat that is surprisingly absent is the shield recharge delay. I know where to find my suit's unaltered recharge delay, but once I use a regulator, I need to whip out the calculator.
Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 1264	Posted - 2013.08.27 18:15:00 - [12] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: To play DUST? Yes I know how to do it, and I do do it, but why can't modified values when skills or modules that grant bonuses just be shown? For example, if you use a complex damage modifier that grants 10% extra to your weapon's damage value, why not just change that value to the new stat when looking at the info in your fitting...why must I whip out a calculator? It is only a minor annoyance, but it is something I hope to see changed in a future update. I appreciate the complaint, but it's surely not that much of an issue is it? I find the maths fun when the product is a maximised combination of modules & weapons. And it's not that difficult to add 10% to 33dmg is it?
Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 1264	Posted - 2013.08.27 18:18:00 - [13] - Quote Nguruthos IX wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: High school algebra is all you really need. Point is High school algebra is what you don't need for pretty much any other game / FPS. So how is that helpful to NPE? This is an rpg too don't forget. Making the most of your fittings is part of the challenge of the game. The first time I bested a better fps player, because I bested their fitting skills was a hugely rewarding moment in my time on this game.
Tuna the Fish The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 82	Posted - 2013.08.27 18:49:00 - [14] - Quote Chunky Munkey wrote: Nguruthos IX wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: High school algebra is all you really need. Point is High school algebra is what you don't need for pretty much any other game / FPS. So how is that helpful to NPE? This is an rpg too don't forget. Making the most of your fittings is part of the challenge of the game. The first time I bested a better fps player, because I bested their fitting skills was a hugely rewarding moment in my time on this game. I think perhaps you (and IWS) might be missing the point. The point is not that we don't want to do math, or spend time building efficient fits. The point is the games UI doesn't accurately reflect your fitting's statistics, which can lead to confusion for new players.
BL4CKST4R WarRavens League of Infamy 1263	Posted - 2013.08.27 18:52:00 - [15] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: To play DUST? Yes I know how to do it, and I do do it, but why can't modified values when skills or modules that grant bonuses just be shown? For example, if you use a complex damage modifier that grants 10% extra to your weapon's damage value, why not just change that value to the new stat when looking at the info in your fitting...why must I whip out a calculator? It is only a minor annoyance, but it is something I hope to see changed in a future update. Don't forget an extra 10% when they "boosted" all weapons damage by 10% in Uprising 1.0.
CHIPMINT BUTTERCUP KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 83	Posted - 2013.08.27 19:31:00 - [16] - Quote Yeah but Crest, spread sheets, and Vita.
Silas Swakhammer GamersForChrist Orion Empire 86	Posted - 2013.08.27 19:47:00 - [17] - Quote Um, the values of attributes do change when you add modules to fittings. What we really need is for them to make more of the values and numbers accessible to us. We need more data, like WPs per death, resistances to specific damage types, most common method of death, etc., etc.
CrotchGrab 360 High-Damage 216	Posted - 2013.08.27 19:49:00 - [18] - Quote I can't math. If you say bro, do you even math? Then I shall say, no... I do not math. Not even simple math. Games frustrate us. That means we don't play them. Any annoyance no matter how small is still detrimental to player retention. And did I mention that I don't even math? I've been forever annoyed and confused about what does what and whether it's the base amount that's being increased or not. Also what percentage the stacking module is. I suck at working out how much PG and CPU I would have if X was here etc etc.
Mossellia Delt Militaires Sans Jeux 81	Posted - 2013.08.27 19:58:00 - [19] - Quote uh... if you need a calculator to do simple math like in dust you need to go back to school.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 7806	Posted - 2013.08.27 20:01:00 - [20] - Quote Well its a UI thing, thoerycrafters will be theorycrafters where a 12 year old math wizard will make you look stupid in 20 seconds flat.

Surt gods end Demon Ronin 884	Posted - 2013.08.27 20:08:00 - [21] - Quote It's not hard to see where Aisha is getting at. Nothing wrong with a bit of SIMPLICITY. dude you said the S word! Oh boy, here come the nerds.
Silas Swakhammer GamersForChrist Orion Empire 87	Posted - 2013.08.27 20:10:00 - [22] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Well its a UI thing, thoerycrafters will be theorycrafters where a 12 year old math wizard will make you look stupid in 20 seconds flat. The world has already seen one too many wizards.
Aisha Ctarl The Generals EoN. 1147	Posted - 2013.08.27 20:24:00 - [23] - Quote Mossellia Delt wrote: uh... if you need a calculator to do simple math like in dust you need to go back to school. Do you know how aggravating it is to upgrade skills or get new modules then to look at the info on your fitting just to see all the base stats without your bonuses factored in?!? I'm sure most CAN do the math, but I can assure you most DON'T want to be bothered to actually do it. I know I sure as hell don't want to do +2% +2% +2% +2% +5% +5%...Answer - write number down in notebook - next stat - +5%+5%+5%...etc. I just want the stats to change to show me my weapon damage, profile signature, stamina regen, sidearm damage, etc with the bonuses factored in.
Leither Yiltron KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 659	Posted - 2013.08.27 20:44:00 - [24] - Quote Sorry, I think you went to some nontrivial effort in your original argument, but CCP doesn't read anything that isn't typeset using latex.
Aisha Ctarl The Generals EoN. 1149	Posted - 2013.08.27 21:25:00 - [25] - Quote Leither Yiltron wrote: Sorry, I think you went to some nontrivial effort in your original argument, but CCP doesn't read anything that isn't typeset using latex. Wat?
Bittersteel the Bastard WarRavens League of Infamy 305	Posted - 2013.08.27 21:26:00 - [26] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: Leither Yiltron wrote: Sorry, I think you went to some nontrivial effort in your original argument, but CCP doesn't read anything that isn't typeset using latex. Wat? -+Que?
Kane Banned Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire 15	Posted - 2013.08.27 21:28:00 - [27] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: To play DUST? Yes I know how to do it, and I do do it, but why can't modified values when skills or modules that grant bonuses just be shown? For example, if you use a complex damage modifier that grants 10% extra to your weapon's damage value, why not just change that value to the new stat when looking at the info in your fitting...why must I whip out a calculator? It is only a minor annoyance, but it is something I hope to see changed in a future update. This is one of the reasons I like dust lol.
Viktor Zokas High-Damage 295	Posted - 2013.08.27 21:36:00 - [28] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: To play DUST? Yes I know how to do it, and I do do it, but why can't modified values when skills or modules that grant bonuses just be shown? For example, if you use a complex damage modifier that grants 10% extra to your weapon's damage value, why not just change that value to the new stat when looking at the info in your fitting...why must I whip out a calculator? It is only a minor annoyance, but it is something I hope to see changed in a future update. Doing %'s aren't hard. You learn it in school. Calculators not needed. But I don't disagree, the info windows need to update new stats.
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2170	Posted - 2013.08.27 21:52:00 - [29] - Quote Problem is they don't even bother giving us all the stats. KAGEHOSHI made a feedback thread about it here. It's not the first one. It is stated exactly NOWHERE in-game what the stacking penalty is. For any stats that aren't displayed on our sidebar, we get to GUESS WTF the friggin calculations are. That's the state of the game. That's not intriguing systems for a sophisticated player. That's not NPE. That's a game that fucks the player for not researching things online and finding some obscure formula from a different game (EVE) just to GUESS where your stats are after you added a module to a suit.. because god help if you want the stats on the thing you're about to wear to actually be listed on the damn screen. That's just too much friggin work! We're clearly all spoiled by the information they do give us, which is why they took out the damage percentage display instead of just fixing it. The less information we have, the more we're kept in the dark about what our equipment SHOULD be doing, and given the state and bugginess of so many other elements in the game this can only hinder things getting fixed in the long-term.
Leither Yiltron KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 659	Posted - 2013.08.27 21:56:00 - [30] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: Leither Yiltron wrote: Sorry, I think you went to some nontrivial effort in your original argument, but CCP doesn't read anything that isn't typeset using latex. Wat? Oh, you don't actually do math academically. Mahbad

Surt gods end Demon Ronin 884	Posted - 2013.08.27 21:57:00 - [31] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: Leither Yiltron wrote: Sorry, I think you went to some nontrivial effort in your original argument, but CCP doesn't read anything that isn't typeset using latex. Wat? He means using the bold, italic, and underline buttons.
Boot Booter Omega Elite Mercs INC. 58	Posted - 2013.08.27 22:06:00 - [32] - Quote Well obviously none of you have invested in the math proficiency skill. See that's your problem right there.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 7816	Posted - 2013.08.27 22:28:00 - [33] - Quote yeah what does accuracy measure?
Aisha Ctarl The Generals EoN. 1154	Posted - 2013.08.28 03:00:00 - [34] - Quote Leither Yiltron wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: Leither Yiltron wrote: Sorry, I think you went to some nontrivial effort in your original argument, but CCP doesn't read anything that isn't typeset using latex. Wat? Oh, you don't actually do math academically. Mahbad Latex is a markup language that's in particularly prolific use in the mathematical sciences. Mostly because it's very extendable and its conventions for typing mathematical symbols are pretty damn natural. Umm Ok....I'm a homeland security major.
Tallen Ellecon KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 637	Posted - 2013.08.28 03:14:00 - [35] - Quote This should be in requests, for an expanded fitting description. I weep for our future if the math needed to play this game is too much for some.
Tuna the Fish The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 86	Posted - 2013.08.28 03:19:00 - [36] - Quote Tallen Ellecon wrote: This should be in requests, for an expanded fitting description. I weep for our future if the math needed to play this game is too much for some. I like how someone asks for the fitting stats to be more detailed and that makes them bad at math.
Another Heavy SOB Pure Innocence. EoN. 640	Posted - 2013.08.28 03:24:00 - [37] - Quote Remember when they said they were fixing the broken damage modifier UI....And then they simply removed it. I'd be careful asking for more info in the dropsuit UI, They may just remove it all together!
Tuna the Fish The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 86	Posted - 2013.08.28 03:33:00 - [38] - Quote Another Heavy SOB wrote: Remember when they said they were fixing the broken damage modifier UI....And then they simply removed it. I'd be careful asking for more info in the dropsuit UI, They may just remove it all together! I can't quite remember, but did they do they same thing to the shield recharge delay, or am I just remembering wrong?
Another Heavy SOB Pure Innocence. EoN. 640	Posted - 2013.08.28 04:00:00 - [39] - Quote Tuna the Fish wrote: Another Heavy SOB wrote: Remember when they said they were fixing the broken damage modifier UI....And then they simply removed it. I'd be careful asking for more info in the dropsuit UI, They may just remove it all together! I can't quite remember, but did they do they same thing to the shield recharge delay, or am I just remembering wrong? I'm not sure about closed beta but I started day 2 of open Beta and it was not displayed in the dropsuit UI.
SHOCKNOFSKY H.Y.S.T.E.R.I.A 3	Posted - 2013.08.28 04:19:00 - [40] - Quote I don'y normally enjoy doing any kind of math, but Dust514 gives me a great excuse for it :) It's a lot like playing Armored Core and crunching the numbers.



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