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HMG is possibly getting nerfed, not buffed in 1.4

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Torr Wrath Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 748	Posted - 2013.08.21 18:58:00 - [1] - Quote Link to the reddit post where I first saw this Link to the post where people say its a buff The relevant conversation. Quote: [11:32:26] Breakin_Stuff will the HMG be more useful on the open maps we have? Or are we adding more CQC stuff? [11:32:57] [CCP]Wolfman not changed the HMG in 1.4 [11:33:34] Breakin_Stuff oh well, I can dream. [11:34:47] [CCP]Wolfman ok well one change [11:34:55] Breakin_Stuff Such as? [11:35:33] [CCP]Wolfman operations skill changed from heat build up reduction to recoil reduction [11:36:21] Breakin_Stuff Wait so I actually have to pay attention to my overheat, and in exchange I get to drill holes in people more accurately? [11:36:22] [CCP]Wolfman 5% a level [11:36:32] [CCP]Wolfman ya [11:36:53] Breakin_Stuff cool. now make it usable on manus peak and other open maps so I can quit forge sniping [11:37:00] [CCP]Wolfman the aiming changes will make a difference for it as well I commented on reddit, but i wanted to specifically warn the people here who missed it. You can negate the HMG kick nearly completely anyway with a trigger trick (you dont need a modded controller, and you can do it with the AR/any other spray and pray weapon too) if you are good enough to know when to do it. So for newbros this should be a solid buff to the HMG, for anyone who has spent 100+ hours with one? This is pretty much another nerf to heavies, albeit a potentially small one. in addition, and no I dont feel like getting the exact numbers, I can but iv done rounding here and used test results from my end. After the 'nerf' HMG at proto will only shoot 270 bullets before overheating after nerf, the advanced about 240, and standards maybe as low as 200. It will make life easier for newbros though so.. shrug After all of this I guess i should tell you all the trick us heavies use who have spent 100+ hours behind the gun. All you have to do is while firing, once the 'targeting circle of death' reaches its minimum radius release the trigger for a fraction of a second and immediatly press it again. You lose next to no DPS, however it will reset the HMGs kick and desire to wander around the screen. In doing this you can retain near perfect accuracy as the HMG wont be interfering with your aim at all. Iv always refered to this technique as feathering the trigger. Assault Rifles use the same technique, but they call it firing in bursts and they normally dont resume firing as quickly. Congratulations to any HMG Heavies who read this and didnt know it! you are now better at this game! Just in time for CCP to nerf us :P To CCP, please if you do this, at least reduce heat generation on the HMGs a bit. I get how you dont want us emptying a whole drum of ammo at once, but if you dont this really is just a nerf to people who spent any real time with the weapon. And the HMG isnt by any means OP at all. Even if you just undo the stealth heat nerf you did in uprising (that I notice you didnt put in the patch notes) it could be enough. Please?
Nguruthos IX Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 1118	Posted - 2013.08.21 19:04:00 - [2] - Quote So youre saying this accidently fixed an exploited game mechanic and buffs the hmg? Good
Torr Wrath Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 748	Posted - 2013.08.21 19:05:00 - [3] - Quote Nguruthos IX wrote: So youre saying this accidently fixed an exploited game mechanic and buffs the hmg? Good Ill be okay with your reasoning if they fix it for the assault rifle, the scrambler rifle, and the SMG too.
RA Drahcir Psygod9 122	Posted - 2013.08.21 19:06:00 - [4] - Quote Seems to be a nerf to me. Starting out, overheating was my biggest problem--recoil never was an issue.
Bears Beets Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 755	Posted - 2013.08.21 19:07:00 - [5] - Quote We'll see how it works in practical application come 1.4. As of right now, I think this change is silly and unnecessary. It's hard to be up-in-arms about something I haven't played with yet, but I'm certainly not excited about this change.
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 122	Posted - 2013.08.21 19:53:00 - [6] - Quote Why not add a hmg sharpshooter skill if they want a less recoil ability?
Kira Lannister Ancient Exiles 1069	Posted - 2013.08.21 19:56:00 - [7] - Quote So the HMG will over heat now?
Lance 2ballzStrong SyNergy Gaming EoN. 3469	Posted - 2013.08.21 20:01:00 - [8] - Quote Who ever overheated their HMG? By the time an HMG gets to overheating it has what, 50 bullets left and the recoil is uncontrollable. They're making it overheat quicker, and reducing the recoil... how is that a nerf exactly? If you're overheating your HMG now, you're doing it wrong.
Cosgar ParagonX 4491	Posted - 2013.08.21 20:06:00 - [9] - Quote I wish they would just take a page from the Brutal Doom mod's minigun. ADS button controls spool up which affects accuracy while it's loud enough to give away your position and the fire button fires the weapon. The overheat mechanic seems out of place when you really can't overheat at level 5 operations.
hooc order Deep Space Republic Top Men. 817	Posted - 2013.08.21 20:06:00 - [10] - Quote You are confusing dispersion with kick. Kick is instantaneous with the HMG...the gun rises with the first bullet all the way to the last. Dispersion with the HMG is bad at the start improves as you fire then peaks then gets worse as you fire.

Kira Lannister Ancient Exiles 1069	Posted - 2013.08.21 20:08:00 - [11] - Quote I never over heat, but if they take away the skill. Might cause it to over heat. I never really had a problem with the kick, it's the dispersion. My main problem with the HMG is the turn speed, if an assault knows what he is doing, he can just out strafe it.
Sean Mcbride 0uter.Heaven 20	Posted - 2013.08.21 20:32:00 - [12] - Quote Only time I over heat is with either the Burst or I am not paying attention. Like others have said if you over heat you are doing it wrong. Most people in range are dead before I overheat anyways. So tell me exactly how is this a nerf.
Halador Osiris Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn 602	Posted - 2013.08.21 20:34:00 - [13] - Quote RA Drahcir wrote: Seems to be a nerf to me. Starting out, overheating was my biggest problem--recoil never was an issue. Well, the good news is that - starting out - you didn't have 5 levels of heat reduction; you had 1.
RA Drahcir Psygod9 124	Posted - 2013.08.21 20:51:00 - [14] - Quote Halador Osiris wrote: RA Drahcir wrote: Seems to be a nerf to me. Starting out, overheating was my biggest problem--recoil never was an issue. Well, the good news is that - starting out - you didn't have 5 levels of heat reduction; you had 1. Yes, and now they are taking it away completely, hence nerf. I keep reiterating, heating is not a current problem, but it will probably be with this update. I can't tell the trolls from the idiots anymore.
Cosgar ParagonX 4499	Posted - 2013.08.21 20:54:00 - [15] - Quote You guys are assuming the base overheat levels won't be adjusted...
RA Drahcir Psygod9 124	Posted - 2013.08.21 20:56:00 - [16] - Quote Cosgar wrote: You guys are assuming the base overheat levels won't be adjusted... The glass is half empty.
Absoliav Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 35	Posted - 2013.08.21 20:57:00 - [17] - Quote Ok, does anyone even remember what Destroyer Mode is?
Cosgar ParagonX 4500	Posted - 2013.08.21 21:00:00 - [18] - Quote RA Drahcir wrote: Cosgar wrote: You guys are assuming the base overheat levels won't be adjusted... The glass is half empty. Yeah, I know that feel. I've been speccing into the SMG for my Minmatar logi, just to be on the safe side.
low genius The Sound Of Freedom Renegade Alliance 332	Posted - 2013.08.21 21:07:00 - [19] - Quote that sounds like exactly the buff the hmg needs. well done wolfman.
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 122	Posted - 2013.08.21 21:12:00 - [20] - Quote low genius wrote: that sounds like exactly the buff the hmg needs. well done wolfman. Except its a nerf not a buff

P14GU3 The Southern Legion 315	Posted - 2013.08.21 21:41:00 - [21] - Quote OP forgets the HMG has spin-up time so bursting fire actually makes it less accurate. The "feathering" trigger only works for ARs and such.
THUNDERGROOVE ZionTCD 149	Posted - 2013.08.21 22:03:00 - [22] - Quote You won't need to fire more bullets if they actually travel in a somewhat straight line.. This and the armor changes make me actually want to run heavy again when 1.4 drops
Lance 2ballzStrong SyNergy Gaming EoN. 3473	Posted - 2013.08.21 22:07:00 - [23] - Quote THUNDERGROOVE wrote: You won't need to fire more bullets if they actually travel in a somewhat straight line.. This and the armor changes make me actually want to run heavy again when 1.4 drops armor changes won't mean a thing but faster movement speed. More hp? lol... doesn't matter when the current FoTM eats armor up, and don't forget the nade spam.
RA Drahcir Psygod9 126	Posted - 2013.08.21 22:33:00 - [24] - Quote THUNDERGROOVE wrote: You won't need to fire more bullets if they actually travel in a somewhat straight line.. This and the armor changes make me actually want to run heavy again when 1.4 drops There is no accuracy buffing, there is only a heat nerf, and a negligible recoil buff. They are only tweaking aiming, which is a user problem, not a HMG problem. We will have to wait for the update before we can pass sound judgement but it definitely looks like a nerf to me, due to the way I use the weapon (continuous suppressive fire, multiple enemy engagements, LAV destroying...)
Torr Wrath Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 758	Posted - 2013.08.21 23:46:00 - [25] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: OP forgets the HMG has spin-up time so bursting fire actually makes it less accurate. The "feathering" trigger only works for ARs and such. No, i am not forgetting this, when you feather the trigger it maintains its spin while delaying the time before the hmg itself starts bouncing all over the place. Feathering the trigger doesnt make it less accurate at all. Cosgar wrote: You guys are assuming the base overheat levels won't be adjusted... Thats because they said that the HMG wasnt changed, only this skill. Its not so much an assumption if they outright said it :P
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Top Men. 1195	Posted - 2013.08.22 00:55:00 - [26] - Quote no numbnuts, CCP devs NEVER said anything about adjusting the base heat levels of the guns OR leaving them alone. We don't know so quit crying that the goddamned sky is falling, chicken little. We need to test this change to see if it is a good one then provide feedback. This one's neither obvious, nor cut and dried. it could go both ways or be a net gain of zero. We don't know for sure because the aiming and hit detection changes aren't something we can take into account because only CCP knows how bad they are.
DeadlyAztec11 Max-Pain-inc Dark Taboo 1955	Posted - 2013.08.22 02:36:00 - [27] - Quote Buffing the recoil is pointless. You are suppose to crouch while shooting at long range. Crouching in of itself negates recoil.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Top Men. 1200	Posted - 2013.08.22 03:57:00 - [28] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Buffing the recoil is pointless. You are suppose to crouch while shooting at long range. Crouching in of itself negates recoil. it also makes you easier to unload an assault rifle magazine into without missing. I would prefer to use tactics that don't mark me as a moron while using the HMG, thank you.
Absoliav Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 35	Posted - 2013.08.22 03:58:00 - [29] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Buffing the recoil is pointless. You are suppose to crouch while shooting at long range. Crouching in of itself negates recoil. Actually, it reduces the bullet spread, the HMG becomes more accurate as you shoot, the only thing that gets crazy is the recoil.
Absoliav Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 35	Posted - 2013.08.22 03:59:00 - [30] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Buffing the recoil is pointless. You are suppose to crouch while shooting at long range. Crouching in of itself negates recoil. it also makes you easier to unload an assault rifle magazine into without missing. I would prefer to use tactics that don't mark me as a moron while using the HMG, thank you. Why would you run with an HMG, better question, how?

RA Drahcir Psygod9 131	Posted - 2013.08.22 05:25:00 - [31] - Quote I am speccing into lasers as a plan B
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Top Men. 1201	Posted - 2013.08.22 05:25:00 - [32] - Quote Absoliav wrote: Why would you run with an HMG, better question, how? I do it all the time, I find it easy. I get in the face of the retards who let me get close and I counterstrafe for great justice. I win almost every 1v1 and most 1v1 then his buddy fights by not hunkering down like a farking pillbug.
Rusty Shallows Black Jackals 278	Posted - 2013.08.22 05:53:00 - [33] - Quote Absoliav wrote: Ok, does anyone even remember what Doom Mode is? lol. Well considering how many people here haven't played the original game the idea is from it might be better to ask how many of us are left get the homage. That game's release can be measured by the decades now.


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