DUST Search - Madrugar Hybrid > Shield Gunnlogi for Spider Tanking

Ld Collins wrote:

Shield tanks are good they are just situational this spider tank formation can be broken up by Gunnlogis with missile turrets since they are only repping shields and shields dont rep while underfire you can hammer down on the spider tanks until they eventually pop. Which shouldnt take long once you start hitting armor. Plus piggy backing off each other means they are dependant on one another and cant travel very far without breaking the shielding tether. Force these tanks into breaking formation and thats all she wrote, now considering they well be going up against heavy AV resistance they most likely wont be using railguns they would need blasters or missiles. Missles will give them range but not accuracy and blaster will give them accuracy but not range. I believe 2 Gunnlogi tanks with Missles can easily become a problem for this formation. This triangle can only defend its self from one side at a time effectively. If you were to take two missle tanks and concentrate on one tank at a time you could easily mop these guys up so long as you keep your distance. Stay out of the reach of there blasters if they have missiles its not too much of a problem.

Id there happened to be 3 gunnlogis with missiles it would be overkill you could lead the formation toward the 2 gunnlogis and have the 3rd approach from the rear or he could railgun sniper the formation bating them into a choke point and the 2 gunnlogis finish them off.

Also the fact that they are using scatter blasters means they dont have range and are prone to overheat.

Ld Collins wrote:

My point is that you dont know what shield tanks are intended for when you pick a shield tank whats harder to fit blaster or missles. Blasters take up more PG which shield tanks dont have and Railguns can take down anything at a distance they use less PG than Blasters. When you pick a shield tank what do you get by default a railgun so you have to come to two conclusions when picking a shield tank do you want to destroy installations or destroy dropships. Because Blasters are for infantry its the best way to counter Av players not a Missile turret or Railgun correct? So what makes you think youre even suppose to shield tank a gunnlogi. If you look at your modules your shield resistance mods take up more cpu than armor resistance mods and your shield resistance cost more sp to lvl than armor resistance mods correct. Every thing about the shield tank is about gaining more CPU. Why is this because missile turrets and railgun turrets use a lot of Cpu if you put resistance turret rotation shield reps and a nirtos with missile turret and possilibly 2 local diagnostic pg youll have a nice fit.

These maddy's are doing fine with 3000k shields you think your suppose to but 6000k shields on your gunnlogi maybe to Railgun snipe.

Now Maddys work well with shields because maddys are designed for close ranged combat thats why they have lots or armor lots of pg more speed they are ment to be up close and personal. Range is their weakness If they fit railguns they give up resistance dps and armor. All in favor of range they lose the ability to defend themselves from Av effectively and find that the safest way to play is on the redline.

Oh and when they play the redline game thats when you could lose your shield tank to railguns but railguns if you counter the maddy railgun with resistance and heat sinks it becomes a game of who gets the last hit its pretty even between the two.


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Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2593	Posted - 2013.08.19 12:54:00 - [1] - Quote Shield Spider Tanking is amazing, I hope everyone knows this already, just gonna throw down some stats for the Converse Boosters and Transporters. Light Converse Shield Booster Recharge per Pulse: 105.0 HP (Total = 525HP regen per use) Pulse Interval: 1.0 s Number of Pulses: 5 Cooldown: 30.0 s Light Converse Shield Transporter Recharge per Pulse: 125.0 HP (Total = 1875HP regen per use) Pulse Interval: 15.0 s Number of Pulses: 1 Cooldown: 15.0 s Heavy Converse Shield Booster Recharge per Pulse: 271.0 HP (Total = 1355HP regen per use) Pulse Interval: 1.0 s Number of Pulses: 5 Cooldown: 30.0 s Heavy Converse Shield Transporter Recharge per Pulse: 325.0 HP (Total = 4875HP regen per use) Pulse Interval: 15.0 s Number of Pulses: 1 (Actually pulses every second) Cooldown: 15.0 s So theres the numbers, as you can see a light converse transporter is actually better than a heavy booster, which makes me question why more vehicles havent got them equipped, they're damn useful. Anyways the reason for the title, A Hybrid Madrugar does so much better than a Shield tanked Gunnlogi, I have about 3000 Shields and 5000 Armor on my Madrugar, It's a spider tank and can actually fit a Heavy Transporter, allowing me to output 4875HP every 30 seconds. Now the main reason it does so much better is if my shields drop, I have the ability to activate my Heavy reppers immediately to negate damage until my fellow spider tanker is ready to shield rep me back up. As an additional note, don't bother with the Armor Transporters, they're the same as an Armor Rep as the Armor Reps are currently bugged. TL;DR go fit a ***** light shield transporter on all your vehicles and rep me, gawd. King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote:** CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.
Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2593	Posted - 2013.08.19 12:57:00 - [2] - Quote ChribbaX wrote: You that bad that you need others to rep you constantly? I like the ability to sit there and just tank damage, it's lovely. More reps pls. King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote: CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.
Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2593	Posted - 2013.08.19 13:03:00 - [3] - Quote BL4CKST4R wrote: I am not a tanker so forgive my ignorance, but what is spider tanking? I believe it's an EVE term when a logistic Ship reps another (Seen pictures, looks like big golden chains in space) For us, it's probably not much different, it's where one vehicle reps another rather than the vehicle repping itself, It's easiest with two tanks but three or more working together with effective communication is very scary. King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote: CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.
Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2593	Posted - 2013.08.19 13:08:00 - [4] - Quote Takahiro Kashuken wrote: Jason ive done that It does work in very situational roles, like for example if you got a chokepoint it works really well Problem is tho is the maddy, its the super weak link depending how you fit it up I got about 4-7 spider fits, some are good but require to be very aware for the entire game, ive had half the enemy team go AV to kill the target tank but if its adv or proto then it can just be too much depending how much of it ther is It does work and ive tried it for a while, havnt lost many tanks as the target tank but as the spider you are generally weaker If we did have a Logi tank, a proper yellow beast for this spider tanking then it would be great but yet again infantry would complain and would want it nerfed I believe the key to spider tanking is being able to hold your own solo but being able to work together, take the Hybrid for example, it's fitted with a Neutron Scattered, Heavy Reps and a Heavy Transporter to rep others, two of these can work by themselves for a little bit but against AV must join together as one. When coming up against AV, one takes the lead, then falls back so that the other Tank takes his place, I saw this with three shield tanks once, except they simply switch who was repping on the lead tank (Triangle Formation), one person would put heavy reps on the tank, then when they run out the next reps would go on, all the while the Gunnlogi was slaying, the other two would hide behind a wall xD King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote: CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.
Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2597	Posted - 2013.08.19 15:20:00 - [5] - Quote ChribbaX wrote: CommanderBolt wrote: ChribbaX wrote: You that bad that you need others to rep you constantly? Wow Chribba making a dig at someone else! This is unprecedented! I'm just jealous I don't get repped like that, I sure could need it bc I'm terribad lol It's obvious, you have been chosen as a replord, not a Tanker. o7 replord. King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote: CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.
Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2631	Posted - 2013.08.22 10:55:00 - [6] - Quote Love this tank when I have someone else running the same fit and is on the ball calling out when reps are ready. It's got nearly no resistances (Armor has either Hardener or Plating) but it's repping power is immense, with the Armor Reps capable of repping like 4500 Armor in seconds, and the Shields also being repped 4500 every 15 seconds this tank is beast, and when your Reps are down, pull back and let your buddy go forward for kills, when his reps are all down you switch out. Under intense fire, make a retreat with both tanks spider repping, It's pretty cool to watch Swarms do ** all to a Madrugar :) King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote:** CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.
Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2633	Posted - 2013.08.22 12:37:00 - [7] - Quote Which reminds me, I'm going to update the post with the fit (In a moment, have to pop to the shop and grab some Monster) as I'd really like to here some feedback, I reduced the Armor to 4800 to gain 3300 shields (I believe I gained 475 Shields over 385 Armor, which is more beneficial) I also found it possible to do the fit and have a Scattered Ion Cannon on it by reducing HP to 2800-2900 Shields, which is very useful. But yeah, will update that in a bit! King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote: CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.
Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2633	Posted - 2013.08.22 13:06:00 - [8] - Quote Updated thread. King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote: CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.
Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2640	Posted - 2013.08.22 17:00:00 - [9] - Quote Takahiro Kashuken wrote: That fit while it is a spider tank relys on another spider tank with shield mods Essentailly in 2 tanks ther is no target tank, a 3rd armor shield tank is needed for the triangle i think While the shield is good if armor is breached and you have no rep you will be generally toast to a point plus with the 120 plate you do lose 800-1500 or armor but you have gained 2k of shield which can and does help with most forms of AV I may try a similar fit if i get time due to the 'war' but maybe have a omni tanked madrugar as the target tank with 2 spider tanks backing it up keeping that shield as high as possible to reduce the damage Plus with it being a armor tank auto ppl will swarm it and even then if shield is gone and breached depending on your fit you have enough armor to tank some more damage while you run or wait for reps and tech it maybe stronger than then gunlogi since you have both types of tank and it doesnt matter what gets hit On paper not too bad, i still say if you can get 3 tanks doing around the same thing then it should work really well In comparison to other Spider Tanks, this one offers more flexibility with the ability to survive a hit from Swarms, sometimes even up to three times before dying. In the past I've run Shield Spiders (Gunnlogi and Sagaris) and this one beats the Gunnlogi easily, hell it beats the Sagaris due to the rep ability of these Heavy Transporters and yet still being able to Armor rep itself too. I find Convoy (2) a lot easier to manage than a with a Triangle (3), aye it's more effective as a Triangle due to the repping ability as well as the ability to switch around in formation, presenting a single tank to the AVers, Convoys are easier to help teach people how to spider but honestly offers the same "target" as the Triangle as the front (point for triangle) would be in lead whilst the repper stays behind it taking cover when possible. That's the bonus with this baby, it comes with a heavy rep, so if your shields are breached, you're able to activate a hardener and reppers just as it goes down, timing it just right means your reps activate just as you start taking damage, giving you enough time to retreat and get your buddy on transporter duty. It might be beneficial (When on point defense) to have a single well buffed vehicle (I run a Gunnlogi with 7000+ Shields, about 10k eHP I believe) as well as a light repper to keep the Logi LAV repped, the buffer might work for point defense and even breaching areas. King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote: CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.
Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2643	Posted - 2013.08.23 02:09:00 - [10] - Quote Tebu Gan wrote: I like this idea. It could destroy, and would require far more infantry to run in AV fits. Be nice if reppin gave you a bit of points though. Aye I agree, even guardian points would be nice :/ King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote: CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.

Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2643	Posted - 2013.08.23 02:15:00 - [11] - Quote Bright Cloud wrote: Buffer fit gunnlogi>hybrid madrugar for teamwork vehicle play. Sure this works in pub matches but in PC matches it doesnt. And the guy who is in the logi lav doesnt even get a single WP for doing that job so its quite unpopular. 2x Hybrid Madrugar > 2x Buffer Gunnlogi. Everytime. Logi LAVs are okay, but if you're going to rep you need it on a HAV, atleast that way they can both rep and cover eachother. King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote: CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.
Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2653	Posted - 2013.08.23 10:09:00 - [12] - Quote Ld Collins wrote: Shield tanks are good they are just situational this spider tank formation can be broken up by Gunnlogis with missile turrets since they are only repping shields and shields dont rep while underfire you can hammer down on the spider tanks until they eventually pop. Which shouldnt take long once you start hitting armor. Plus piggy backing off each other means they are dependant on one another and cant travel very far without breaking the shielding tether. Force these tanks into breaking formation and thats all she wrote, now considering they well be going up against heavy AV resistance they most likely wont be using railguns they would need blasters or missiles. Missles will give them range but not accuracy and blaster will give them accuracy but not range. I believe 2 Gunnlogi tanks with Missles can easily become a problem for this formation. This triangle can only defend its self from one side at a time effectively. If you were to take two missle tanks and concentrate on one tank at a time you could easily mop these guys up so long as you keep your distance. Stay out of the reach of there blasters if they have missiles its not too much of a problem. Id there happened to be 3 gunnlogis with missiles it would be overkill you could lead the formation toward the 2 gunnlogis and have the 3rd approach from the rear or he could railgun sniper the formation bating them into a choke point and the 2 gunnlogis finish them off. Also the fact that they are using scatter blasters means they dont have range and are prone to overheat. Shield Tanks aren't good, don't pretend they are. You're talking to Exmaple (A shield Tanker whom has all my respects, I had a list of Tankers I had to kill for me to feel good, He was on it along with Meode, Dark Cloud and a few others) who knows exactly what he's talking about. I don't think you quite understand, Passively a Vehicle won't rep its shields, but the Madrugars are repping eachother like they were activating boosters (with 3x more effectiveness) there is no way the Gunnlogi can out DPS the damage, and if you bring 3 against the two tanks already in formation, it's 50/50 you'll kill them, but because it's 3 vs 2, but then again they might win.. I'm going to assure you, there is no reason to break the tether on this convoy, with both tanks repping 4500 shields every 15 seconds, with a 15 second cooldown, and with the ability to rep themselves with a heavy Armor Regenerator (You know, the OP things that regen over 4500 Armor, which FYI shouldn't because that's what Armor Transporters are for.) means you're going to need to output a crazy amount of damage on a single target to kill him, giving them enough time to retreat and head back to the redline. Ld Collins wrote: My point is that you dont know what shield tanks are intended for when you pick a shield tank whats harder to fit blaster or missles. Blasters take up more PG which shield tanks dont have and Railguns can take down anything at a distance they use less PG than Blasters. When you pick a shield tank what do you get by default a railgun so you have to come to two conclusions when picking a shield tank do you want to destroy installations or destroy dropships. Because Blasters are for infantry its the best way to counter Av players not a Missile turret or Railgun correct? So what makes you think youre even suppose to shield tank a gunnlogi. If you look at your modules your shield resistance mods take up more cpu than armor resistance mods and your shield resistance cost more sp to lvl than armor resistance mods correct. Every thing about the shield tank is about gaining more CPU. Why is this because missile turrets and railgun turrets use a lot of Cpu if you put resistance turret rotation shield reps and a nirtos with missile turret and possilibly 2 local diagnostic pg youll have a nice fit. These maddy's are doing fine with 3000k shields you think your suppose to but 6000k shields on your gunnlogi maybe to Railgun snipe. Now Maddys work well with shields because maddys are designed for close ranged combat thats why they have lots or armor lots of pg more speed they are ment to be up close and personal. Range is their weakness If they fit railguns they give up resistance dps and armor. All in favor of range they lose the ability to defend themselves from Av effectively and find that the safest way to play is on the redline. Oh and when they play the redline game thats when you could lose your shield tank to railguns but railguns if you counter the maddy railgun with resistance and heat sinks it becomes a game of who gets the last hit its pretty even between the two. The problem is, the Madrugar beats the Gunnlogi in every field. Missiles are atrocious weapons that need a buff (ever since that triple nerf hammer it's been ** :/ ) Why pick a Gunnlogi to rail gun? My Madrugar does it better, has more HP and repping ability, and still has the ability to put two damage mods on. Seriously bud, stop pretending, Gunnlogis will lose in every situation against a Madrugar (Unless the Madrugar is stupid enough to fit Missiles xD, even then it outreps you and runs away.) King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote:** CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.
Jason Pearson Seraphim Auxiliaries 2653	Posted - 2013.08.23 10:10:00 - [13] - Quote ZeHealingHurts HurtingHeals wrote: Jason Pearson wrote: Light Converse Shield Transporter Recharge per Pulse: 125.0 HP (Total = 1875HP regen per use) Pulse Interval: 15.0 s Number of Pulses: 1 Cooldown: 15.0 s wat He is the core gamer, the bastard child of the casual and hardcore gamer. He invests the former's effort and cries when he doesn't get the latter's results. CrotchGrab 360 wrote: You're so philosophical. please adorn me with more pearls of wisdom. Yup.. xD I don't understand why more people don't have this little beauty on their fits, less PG than a Light Shield Booster as well and yet still reps 3x as much. King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! gbghg wrote: CCP Rejavik CCP Shanghia Same company different studios, one has near perfected the player feedback process, the other is still rolling on the floor after it fell over its first baby step.