DUST Search - [IDEA} As vehicles take damage, have their turrets shut down.

Nova Knife wrote:

I'd actually enjoy seeing localized damage on vehicles. Being able to shoot the treads of a tank, tires of an LAV, or thrusters of a dropship to render them immobile or slower would be fantastic. Damage to turrets sounds tricky, but nice in concept. Being able to disable or slow the firing or turn arc of the turrets would make it useful for infantry to give themselvs time to escape or regoup, or make it easier for their AV teammates to take out the vehicles.

This would be very tricky to do though. It'd seem reasonable that shields would protect against such damage but then shield tanks would be infinitely superior to armor tanks unless armor provided similar protection. Maybe a better way would be for each part of the tank to have its own durability/hitpoints, which would regenerate slowly over time after taking damage. After hitting 50% damage movement/mobility of the damaged part is reduced, and so on. I'm not sure how I feel about being able to permanently destroy a turret or thread/wheel/thruster. It seems like it'd be a good idea but I think it should be a alot trickier to do than disabling the part in question.

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Cobalt Monkey Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 140	Posted - 2012.07.17 02:00:00 - [1] - Quote Keep in mind that it is all from experience with this build. Who knows how well this would work when it's all put together? I was kind of already hoping it worked this way, but was recently corrected. Oftentimes when I land hits on a tank or drophip I'll get the +25 notification. I'm not at all sure what it's for though. Breaking though shields? Damaging armor? All well and good. Points are points, after all. But I'd much rather see a real effect from my efforts. As the title implies, I'd like to see turrets go offline as the vehicle takes heavy damage. Other things to possibly consider: Having a gunner die/get ejected at that point too. Having the turret become operational again when the damage is repaired to full. Obviously save the driver's seat for last as it would be the most protected and still give tanks their chance to get away.
EVICER 63	Posted - 2012.07.17 02:11:00 - [2] - Quote I dont know why im even commenting on this. How bout you can move your arm in your dropsuit when you get shot at.....lol
gangsta nachos Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 377	Posted - 2012.07.17 02:14:00 - [3] - Quote I like
Cobalt Monkey Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 140	Posted - 2012.07.17 02:38:00 - [4] - Quote Nachos, somehow I knew you'd like something that even remotely inconveniences tanks. EVICER wrote: I dont know why im even commenting on this. That makes two of us. Technically that might apply to dropsuits as well. However, the fact that it doesn't is a concession made to keep the game fun for everyone. I think that this would add a little more risk, since the gunner currently stands to lose very little while riding in someone else's tank/ship and racking up free kills (free in that he didn't buy the vehicle, skill up in it, etc). He would either be killed outright, or simply taken out of the action for a minute when the driver/pilot repairs. Even on high armor tanks/ships it doesn't take them long to get back to full if they can retreat a bit.
gangsta nachos Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 377	Posted - 2012.07.17 02:41:00 - [5] - Quote Cobalt Monkey wrote: Nachos, somehow I knew you'd like something that even remotely inconveniences tanks. EVICER wrote: I dont know why im even commenting on this. That makes two of us. Technically that might apply to dropsuits as well. However, the fact that it doesn't is a concession made to keep the game fun for everyone. I think that this would add a little more risk, since the gunner currently stands to lose very little while riding in someone else's tank/ship and racking up free kills (free in that he didn't buy the vehicle, skill up in it, etc). He would either be killed outright, or simply taken out of the action for a minute when the driver/pilot repairs. Even on high armor tanks/ships it doesn't take them long to get back to full if they can retreat a bit. Have a like for knowing what I like
Nova Knife Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 789	Posted - 2012.07.17 03:48:00 - [6] - Quote I'd actually enjoy seeing localized damage on vehicles. Being able to shoot the treads of a tank, tires of an LAV, or thrusters of a dropship to render them immobile or slower would be fantastic. Damage to turrets sounds tricky, but nice in concept. Being able to disable or slow the firing or turn arc of the turrets would make it useful for infantry to give themselvs time to escape or regoup, or make it easier for their AV teammates to take out the vehicles. This would be very tricky to do though. It'd seem reasonable that shields would protect against such damage but then shield tanks would be infinitely superior to armor tanks unless armor provided similar protection. Maybe a better way would be for each part of the tank to have its own durability/hitpoints, which would regenerate slowly over time after taking damage. After hitting 50% damage movement/mobility of the damaged part is reduced, and so on. I'm not sure how I feel about being able to permanently destroy a turret or thread/wheel/thruster. It seems like it'd be a good idea but I think it should be a alot trickier to do than disabling the part in question.
Ryan Martel Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 27	Posted - 2012.07.17 04:03:00 - [7] - Quote Nova Knife wrote: I'd actually enjoy seeing localized damage on vehicles. Being able to shoot the treads of a tank, tires of an LAV, or thrusters of a dropship to render them immobile or slower would be fantastic. Damage to turrets sounds tricky, but nice in concept. Being able to disable or slow the firing or turn arc of the turrets would make it useful for infantry to give themselvs time to escape or regoup, or make it easier for their AV teammates to take out the vehicles. This would be very tricky to do though. It'd seem reasonable that shields would protect against such damage but then shield tanks would be infinitely superior to armor tanks unless armor provided similar protection. Maybe a better way would be for each part of the tank to have its own durability/hitpoints, which would regenerate slowly over time after taking damage. After hitting 50% damage movement/mobility of the damaged part is reduced, and so on. I'm not sure how I feel about being able to permanently destroy a turret or thread/wheel/thruster. It seems like it'd be a good idea but I think it should be a alot trickier to do than disabling the part in question. Nah too complicated to implement in my opinion as Nova states. Nice idea on paper however. I'm more on board with the finite turret ammo since to me it makes more sense and would be easier to implement. Not to mention it would probably encourage more teamwork since now it gives LAV drivers and nano hives much more value to a tank driver and his gunners.
Cobalt Monkey Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 140	Posted - 2012.07.17 04:20:00 - [8] - Quote Specific hit locations might be too much, yeah. Believe me, I'd love to go for the tank equivalent of a headshot, but I think this idea is about as close as we can get. As far as just effecting the turrets, couldn't you just say that one stops functioning as long as the vehicle is below a certain percentage of EHP? (That does stand for Effective Hit Points, right? As in total between shields and armor?) For the "why" of it say that the shields drain more power as they get closer to collapse since they're trying hard to recharge and that pulls power from the other systems, or some other handwave. If it improves the game (and I do acknowledge that as an IF) then it doesn't matter what bit of lore we throw in to explain it. So, just as an example let's say: 40% EHP = down one turret 20% EHP = down two turrets 10% EHP = mobility and mods only Nothing behind those numbers, just spitballing. That doesn't discount the finite ammo possibility, of course. I think that's one that's got some merit too.
Zero Harpuia Maverick Conflict Solutions 422	Posted - 2012.07.17 04:53:00 - [9] - Quote EHP is shield plus armor plus resistances to specific damage type. You may just want to use Total HP or Armor HP. Also, limited ammo, yes please.
Cobalt Monkey Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 140	Posted - 2012.07.17 04:55:00 - [10] - Quote Cool. I'll go with Total HP then.

Iron Wolf Saber BetaMax. 2867	Posted - 2012.07.17 05:27:00 - [11] - Quote I rather have EMP and Webfiers and Turret Damps.
Cobalt Monkey Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 140	Posted - 2012.07.17 05:40:00 - [12] - Quote If they've got better ways to handle this I'm all for it. :)
Iron Wolf Saber BetaMax. 2867	Posted - 2012.07.17 05:45:00 - [13] - Quote Cobalt Monkey wrote: If they've got better ways to handle this I'm all for it. :) EMP shuts things down regardless so slowdown in systems guns inop for a bit and the sorts. Webifiers slow down vehicles that get caught in it thus it can bring a HAV to a crawl making it mincemeat to hostiles. Dampeners make turrets not aim as good reducing thier range refire rates, turn rates and possibly damage. Also it may be possible the weapons are going capacitor based so any electronic warfare system that drains cap could shut it down as well. This isnt eve where we have a layer of health that is not tankable before death where this could be implmented as armor and shields are different kinds of tanking methoods.
Cobalt Monkey Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 140	Posted - 2012.07.17 05:55:00 - [14] - Quote Huh. I wonder if we could shut down enemy com chat?
Minmatar Slave 74136 Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 291	Posted - 2012.07.17 06:20:00 - [15] - Quote Or cut into the tank's speed and handling as the damage piles up - making it harder to run from that forge gunner who is about to make a few new vent holes in your tank.
Raynor Ragna 266	Posted - 2012.07.17 06:57:00 - [16] - Quote This is one of the dumbest ideas I've heard. Why would a tank not be able to fire if it gets hit??
Cobalt Monkey Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 140	Posted - 2012.07.17 07:01:00 - [17] - Quote Raynor Ragna wrote: This is one of the dumbest ideas I've heard. Why would a tank not be able to fire if it gets hit?? Wow. The concept of a badly damaged machine not working as if in perfect condition escapes you? Just wow. I certainly have to wonder if you read anything beyond the title. Now, whether or not it's right for the game is another story altogether, and in that you're certainly allowed a dissenting opinion.
Cobalt Monkey Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 140	Posted - 2012.07.17 07:03:00 - [18] - Quote Minmatar Slave 74136 wrote: Or cut into the tank's speed and handling as the damage piles up - making it harder to run from that forge gunner who is about to make a few new vent holes in your tank. That'd be nice, but I'm not trying to make them easy pickings. All this would really do is force them to be a little more cautious and more vigilant on their repairs and shield buffs. Possibly make them retreat a little sooner.
Martin0 Brancaleone Maphia Clan Corporation CRONOS. 191	Posted - 2012.07.17 07:12:00 - [19] - Quote This would nerf armor tanked tanks a lot and doesen't touch shield tanks.
Cobalt Monkey Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 140	Posted - 2012.07.17 14:55:00 - [20] - Quote That's why I suggested basing it on the percentage of Total HP between armor and shields. Of course, since then Iron Wolf has suggested several other viable options, so I'm not sure it's needed.

Gatsu Scarz Bragian Order Amarr Empire 55	Posted - 2012.07.17 15:03:00 - [21] - Quote It would be nice to see vehicles have different hit box's ie you could disable the turrets/tracks ect. it would be kinda sweet for vehicle uses cus they would be a chance not to lose the all unit its self,allowing for cheaper repairs. Just an idea.
Cobalt Monkey Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 140	Posted - 2012.07.17 23:58:00 - [22] - Quote I think that would only really work for some kind of much larger vehicle, which I would like to see at some point. I think someone posted something about that a while back, and if done well it might be cool. Need much bigger fields though. It'd be cool to have something on the order of a Halo--gasp The dreaded H word!--Scarab. Essentially a moving complex that has to be boarded by air and taken, but not quite so otherwise invincible as those were. Give it hit zones like the "legs" to slow it down/make it boardable from the ground, damage any weapons on it, etc. As it stands against a tank now though, anything you fire at it to any effect is going to be too big for real strategic shooting. Then again, we haven't seen all the weapons yet.
Xocoyol Zaraoul Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 259	Posted - 2012.07.18 00:05:00 - [23] - Quote This suggestion would make armor tanking worthless. -1
Cobalt Monkey Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 140	Posted - 2012.07.18 00:05:00 - [24] - Quote Again, not if it went off of Total HP instead of just Armor.
Raynor Ragna 266	Posted - 2012.07.18 01:31:00 - [25] - Quote Cobalt Monkey wrote: That's why I suggested basing it on the percentage of Total HP between armor and shields. Of course, since then Iron Wolf has suggested several other viable options, so I'm not sure it's needed. This is why I think this is an idiotic idea. A sagaris would start shutting down while its still in shields. Its not a good idea.
Zeran Haggai Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 196	Posted - 2012.07.18 01:47:00 - [26] - Quote Even as dedicated Forge toting vehicle killer i'm giving this idea a big fat no. Taking away anyone's ability to defend themselves when they need it the most is a bad idea. I wouldn't want my heavy suit to loose it's ability to shoot it's gun when my armor get's low, vehicles shouldn't have to deal with something so ridiculous either. Vehicles are mostly fine atm. The only real problems i have with them are their infinite ammo and fairly high RoF on turrets with almost no cooldown/delay/reload of any kind allowing for very successful spray and pray gunning. I'd like it if they made it so gunners had to worry about their aim a little more when firing. Also the fact that dropships don't explode when their HP reaches 0 is irritating and should be addressed. Other than that vehicles seem fine and i really don't think CCP should touch them until we see how the other AV options that are coming affect them.
Cobalt Monkey Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 140	Posted - 2012.07.18 09:22:00 - [27] - Quote Taking a moment to thank Raynor for reminding me there's a Hide Posts option. Disagreeing is fine, but you can still be respectful about it. Notice how these other guys don't automatically agree with me, but I still respond to their points in a genial manor? It's because they're not childish about it. @Zeran, I'm perfectly fine with waiting as well. It's an idea, not necessarily the best idea. When you're talking about these vehicles, shutting down one of their turrets isn't taking away their ability to defend themselves. Tanks have three of the things, and dropships aren't meant to stand and fight, after all. All it would do is make them more aware of their shields and armor, and more prone to run a little faster rather than only when on the brink of death. If they get to the point that the main gun stops working, then they're probably toast anyway, but I will concede that taking the main gun offline at all is perhaps a bit much. This is mostly about chipping at their map control. If they have to back off slightly earlier, then that's a little more time for the other team to make a little headway.
Ten-Sidhe Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 414	Posted - 2012.07.18 17:43:00 - [28] - Quote total hp/ehp limits wil hurt armour tanks. ehp less, since armour hardners will increase the portion of total hp in the armour. Maybe have smaller hit-boxes for components, Say each track has 1/2 hit points of vehicles, so if all damage is focused in one spot the the vehicle will only be able to go in circle, or a turrent that takes 1/2 total damage will not turn(limit fire to left/right 22.5 degrees or so) so it has to be aimed by turning the tank. Small turrets with say 1/4 total hitpoints, traverse cut in 1/2 when damaged. restrictions to avoid nerfing vehicles A) put a limit on range these hit-boxes apply, so a swarm from across the map won't damage a turret, but putting several demo charges on the side could blow a track. B)Ignore splash from more then 1/2m, so other parts of tank don't get damaged by accident. rewards good targeting, not spamming blasts. Carefully placed demo/grenades still damage parts. C)damage to small hit-box subtracts from main hp, and components hp. Repair/shield regen heals main hp and all the small hitbox hp as well. So, if the tank is impaired and hits a repair its fixed, or if the attacker leaves it alone long enough for its shield to start regen it will drive off to recover and be back. So immobilizing(partially) a tank would require large amounts of concentrated fire at close range, and continued damage to keep it immobile.
EnglishSnake Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 1012	Posted - 2012.07.18 19:52:00 - [29] - Quote No it doesnt happen in EVE Its shouldnt be like BF3 where 1 RPG and your a sitting duck


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